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disco005

Same Run - Please Post Em If You Have Em!

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Check out the weird knobs on these two. They would sorta make sense if they were at the poles, but they are not. Quality control was out to lunch when these were made. Aside from the knobs they are I guess for lack of a better term burned. They have a surface discolouration that looks like rust staining, as do several others in the group pic. Nothing I know will get it off. Not even a razor blade. Any thoughts on how to fix this?

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Wow ... where did you get so many?

In the first two views the knobs look flattish -- like spots which I assumed were nozzle marks on other marbles. Now, thanks to the view of the protuberances, when I see those other marbles again I'm going to think those round marks were places were the marbles where touching and then broke apart and the potential knob got smoothed down.

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It seems that the use of "Same Run" for machine mades is an attempt to twist the term "Same Cane" into machine made territory. That attempt makes no sense to me. Machine made types of the same pattern, same size and same glass chemistry were run for a very, very long time....YEARS in many cases. That was the purposeful plan - to consistently make the same successful type to fill orders over a long, long time.

With the very rare exception of true bona fide experimentals - use of the term "same run" makes no sense for machine mades. You could hold 4 marbles of the exact same design and they could each have been made a year apart - and no-one could tell the difference.

Borrowing the "same cane" handmade idea just doesn't apply to machine mades.

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It seems that the use of "Same Run" for machine mades is an attempt to twist the term "Same Cane" into machine made territory. That attempt makes no sense to me. Machine made types of the same pattern, same size and same glass chemistry were run for a very, very long time....YEARS in many cases. That was the purposeful plan - to consistently make the same successful type to fill orders over a long, long time.

With the very rare exception of true bona fide experimentals - use of the term "same run" makes no sense for machine mades. You could hold 4 marbles of the exact same design and they could each have been made a year apart - and no-one could tell the difference.

Borrowing the "same cane" handmade idea just doesn't apply to machine mades.

I use the term "Same Run" to refer to modern machine made marbles that were made during the known same session of marble making. The term "Same Run" has great use when referring to JABOs, Sammy's Mountain Marbles, and DAS. It is also used correctly with some modern runs of Vitros, Champions, Peltiers, and Mid Atlantics IMHO.

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It has probably stuck and will not change but a problem when using it with the Jabos, Sammys is that there were often hundreds of varieties of marbles made in the time period "the Run" was done in. So I think we are actually talking about two or maybe 3 completely different meanings for "Run" when it comes to marbles. So like many words in the English language it really can have many definitions.

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I think Alan's right about the "same cane" idea not transferring very well -- or at all -- to "same run" in machine-made marbles, for the reasons he stated.

I also see Nantuketdink's point about the use of the term "same run" with the new runs at JABO, etc., but as Galen mentions, it really has a very different meaning in that context. A number of different styles/patterns/color combos of marbles came from the first Joker run, for example. I think it was customary at the time to speak of "families" of marbles in a run when speaking of a group of similarly-patterned-and-colored marbles within a run.

Is that still the case?

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I also agree with Alan. I don't think same run applies to machine mades. The same as i have said for many years.

Are same run look alikes same colors and pattern ?

Is same run a time period from when the first marbles rolls down the rolls continueous until the last one does ?

At Jabo Dave made the same exact colors and pattern marbles in more than one run. Some months apart and some years apart. Are they same run ?

I have seen 20 to 50+ very different looking marbles in a 2000lb. run at Jabo. Are they all same run ?

Are Akro lemonades same color popeyes same color corks etc. SAME RUN. In my opinion NO.

Maybe Mid Atlantic swirls were all made in one single run. But they are different colors.

If you look in this thread the words same run most people think or visualize very similar or same looking marbles.

But with machine mades they may not have been produced in the same run the same day or same year.

They are just the same,look alike,near the same or similar.

Then comes the problem of defining machine made run.

What is a machine made run ? Is it a certian weight ? Is it a time period ? Is is a size ? Is it a style swirl,patch,ribbon,cork ?

I agree that the terms Run or especially Same Run is just confusion with machine mades. They have lots of different meanings to a lot of different collectors.

When the Joker "run" was done. That group of marbles start to finish was named Joker and later Joker 1 . None of the names of the Jabo special investor groups marbles that i know of included Run in the name.

Depending on how and when used one word can define it describe it or cause confusion. I try to refrain from using same run with machine mades. But i have heard run associated with Jabo so many years. That i have used run when discussing Jabo. Because i usually knew the start or begining and finish period for a certian group of marbles.

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These are about close as I'd suppose are from the same run. Based on pattern and the faint strands that turn into a more obvious oxblood. Sure odds are against them being consecutive but...?

Now, when it comes to handmades I'd agree there are a few more nuances that be identified. Came across a situation earlier this year where a fellow member had (2) and I had (1) all over 2" that are bang on unusual pattern handmades that I'd wager lunch as being 'same run'

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"Same Run",can be accurate when describing the modern runs,like the Jabo's/Sammy's/DAS marbles.

Even many of the Jabo classics can be determined to be "same run".

The reason,it has been documented and or witnessed.

We KNOW,Jabo Woodstock fit the bill,but even that was just one particular marble in a "run".

Of course,as Galen pointed out,a "same run" for these marble is differant

than when the term is applied to vintage machine mades.

Its not accurate unless you do some assuming or speculating.

Im sure there are some vintage machine mades that there is no mistake,they were done in a

same run,but I wouldnt be looking at the masses of blue and yellow popeyes.It would be something

unique and similar.

Alan is spot on,with the carry over term,from same cane to same run.

HEY!--There is a murder of crows,working on some fresh,filletless trout in the back yard.

They all look the same to me.Im thinking they are all from the same nest.

It doesnt realy matter to me,either way.If someone says "same run" when identifying

similar or identical marbles,Im gonna think what I think.

It sure does look nice,when you have close matches lined up in a box set.

There is an interesting question that just smacked me in the head,,,

Is there any documentation in existance,that might provide some details about colors and production numbers,

of vintage marbles?--I mean,specific to a daily/weekly/monthly production and not just colors,companies used.

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The only one I know for sure that has that info is MFC. But those are not purely machine-made marbles.

Maybe someone who has seen all of the Pelt paperwork could tell us if anything similar is there?

Betcha MK has some records . . .

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Hmmmm . . . when the colors/color combos are that weird, maybe there are times we can say yes. Or at least "Wow, maybe so . . ."

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