Antique German Marble Number 1

[Geordies Liggies]

Hi.

First real post on the site, so please forgive any errors in etiquette. Just point out my mistakes and I will learn.

I have been collecting german handmades for about 10 years. I recently aquired two marbles from an antique dealer in a town about 30 km from Lauscha.

The original description of the marble was "Original Great Old marble about 34 mm with silver shimmer demolition glass RARE!", and I managed to buy both for a reasonable price. I was quite excited when they arrived, as they are unlike any in my collection.

After some additional correspondence, the seller tells me that both marbles were found together, beneath the floorboards of a house, during a 'Haushaltsauflösung' (literal translation "budget resolution", Actually a legal term which is the clearance of a dwelling, including related ancillary rooms (basement, attic) by the apartment owner following death, eviction, etc. of tennant). It sounds lika an estate sale in which the house was literally stripped bare. Other than that, he had no additional information.

The marbles arrives, and are undoubtedly handmade, but are different to any in my collection, and do not closely match any images I can find online. For this reason, I would appreaciate the views of the Marble Connection community, particularly those specialising in Antique German handmades.

The first marble is 35mm diameter, naked, 9 strand latticino (orangey red) with plenty of mica. It appears to have 1 melted pontil and 1 ground pontil. Both are small.

There are a small number of bubbles, mainly near the surface. One of the bubbles protrudes slightly from the surface. but has not popped (indicating, I guess, that the marble has not been polished). The glass can appear to have a slightly pink hue, but I think that this is down to the reflection of the twist, by the mica.

The marble is pretty spherical, but has one rather flattened area (which does not coincide with either pontil).

Hopefully, you will see these in the attached gallery album.

That is about it! What do you reckon folks?

p.s. I will post details of the second marble soon.

[Swissmarble]

You bought these one ebay Germany on 18th December, right ? Both are newer marbles, probably made in Lauscha. The Bulgarian fakes look different. Unfortunately there are fake-marbles from Germany too, here are some. And I would put your two marbles in the same cagegory..... Nice, but modern/fake antique.

Ron

[Geordies Liggies]

Hi Ron,

You are absolutely right, the marbles were purchased on e-bay 18th Dec, from a guy who runs an antique shop 'Antikhandel Bethge' at Bayrische str. 1, 07356 Lobenstein, Deutschland.

I had seen the fake marbles which you show above (at least I had seen number 1 and number 4) and reckoned they were fakes as they didn't look right and were given quite a high starting price. Having said that, I would probably have been caught out by the sulphides so I REALLY appreciate your update.

The main reason that I thought the two I got might be genuine, was because they were advertised only in the German language and made absolutely no reference to any of the terms which might have resulted in getting a high price for them, such as 'mica' or 'blizzard'. I would have thought that someone selling reproductions as originals would have been aiming to maximize his profit.

Ah well, I'll ask Murphy's to withdraw my lot from the sale and cancel the Caribbean cruise.

I would really appreciate any members who have, or do in future, come across marbles matching the ones which I bought, to drop me a message.

It hasn't worked out too badly, as I have finally got round to posting on Marble Connection, have 2 eye-catching marbles for less than 20GBP and have received advise which may prevent me from being duped on a sulphide.

Thanks again and best wishes,

Steve

[Steph]

Congrats on the successful posting. Glad someone was able to answer. I'm useless with handmades. But I'm pretty good at bumping until we get someone who can answer.

Thanks Ron for helping out.

[Swissmarble]

Congrats on the successful posting. Glad someone was able to answer. I'm useless with handmades. But I'm pretty good at bumping until we get someone who can answer.

Thanks Ron for helping out.

Thanks Steph

Just an idea. Why don't you open a section "fake marbles" ? Not just a thread, a seperate section. I think it is really important to educate people about all those fakes.

Ron

[Steph]

I could run that by Lou. What would we call it?

I could see us running into potential problems, with people threatening to sue Lou.

Not saying no. Just first having trouble thinking about a name which wouldn't be insulting to contemps which don't pretend to be fakes or repros. And then thinking about what kind of mail Lou might get from ebayers threatening to shut him down if he (they'll make it personal) doesn't stop libelling him. Edit: And one more reason -- there has been concern that some people would use detailed threads like that to improve their handwork. Like repro ceramic painters learning how to do more convincing paint jobs.

I think I will start a thread though while we think more about this.

[Steph]

Here's a thread for examples:

Mostly Pix - " Fakes ", Reproductions, Fantasy, Etc.

Maybe after we have discussions like in this thread, the person with the marbles decided to be reproductions can add them to that thread. Could link back to the discussion if that would be helpful.

[Geordies Liggies]

Hi Ron/Steph,

That sounds like an excellent idea, but I would suggest that we may be jumping the gun in declaring these marbles as 'fakes'.

At present, the most that we have established is that the marbles are probably contemporary but were described by the seller as old.

So far, my internet searches have revealed no sign of matching or similar marbles being offered for sale elsewhere. I cannot even find images of these marbles in any context other than my purchase on e-bay and subsequent rewuest for help with an ID on this site.

If the same, or similar, marbles start to appear on e-bay etc. then I will be happy to post these as fakes. Until such time, I'd prefer to consider them one-off's with an unknown pedigree. 😁

Hope that this seems reasonable,

Steve

[Steph]

No problem, Steve! Understood.

My thread will just hopefully be a cleaned up, presentable version of something I started some years ago which went a little off the rails and then was forgotten.

[Geordies Liggies]

It sounds like a very useful resource Steph.

[Steph]

thanks