Steph

Mostly auction pix. Sources provided where I know them. Marble King blister pack. Has 1979 style choking hazard sticker. (click to enlarge) Six Fancy Jumbo Kitty Cucumber Marbles. Bottle green cat's eyes, cute box, from Hong Kong, bought at the Smithsonian museum shop. Box is copyrighted 1984. Yes, this is a mainly for newbies thread. Would you like to help them out? Do you have any marbles that you're reasonably sure came from 1970 or later to share?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=180132492028 $522!!!!!

Bar Codes The bar code was developed in 1948 and patented in 1952. The technology was developed further and applied with varying degrees of sucess in industrial applications in the 1960's. Its first retail use was in 1974. The first item scanned was a pack of Wrigley's gum at a supermarket in Ohio. By the late 70's, 85% of all retail products had bar codes. Sources: A Short History of Bar Code at Bar Code 1 The History of Barcodes, an article by Tony Seideman

This is a summary of some things I know, some educated guesses, and a few questions I still have. ========= Zip Codes in Company Addresses The 5-digit Zip Code was announced in 1963. So, if someone tries to tell you a marble bag is from the 1950’s but you see a zip code on it, something’s fishy! The precursor to Zip Codes were the 1- or 2-digit Postal Zones which larger cities were assigned starting in 1943. For example, if you see an address such as Akron 10, Ohio or Chicago 5, ILL., on a header, that's a good sign that the product is vintage! The 9-digit “Zip + 4” was introduced in 1983. I seldom see the extra digits on any packaging even now, so the lack of the digits doesn't mean anything special. But if you see it, then you know you are looking at newer packaging. An example is Galen's bag here, Anacortes Vitros, ca. 1989-1992. Age Warnings on Marble Bags Congress' Consumer Product Safety Act of 1972 created the Consumer Product Safety Commission, which began operating in 1973. Their first charge included working with manufacturers to establish voluntary safety standards. So that would be about when warning statements such as "For ages 3 and up" statement began to be placed on small toys. Then, after collecting more data, it appears to have been determined that for some toys the voluntary warnings weren't effective enough. And that's where the 1979 Child Safety Protection Act comes in, replacing the friendly recommendation "For ages 3 and up" with the more forbidding "CHOKING HAZARD, Not for children under 3 years" and the standardized triangular hazard symbol. One notable example illustrating the change in warnings is the Marble King blister packs with the horseshoe arrangement of marbles. Here are photos of two of those packages from eBay auctions. Both have small, easy on the eye warnings on the left edge of the card saying "For ages 3 and up". So both of these were printed after 1972. But only one was likely sold in the 70's. That's the one on the left. You can see the little dimestore style price sticker on the one on the left, but more importantly you can still see at the bottom of the card that what you were buying was "40 American Made Glass Marbles". What are you getting in the package on the right? A Choking Hazard. The harsher 1979 warning sticker has been placed over the American Made statement. (My thanks to CrazyRandy217 at LOM for getting me on the right track with the age warnings.) My next questions are: "For ages 3 and up" is less cautious than what we see on current marble packages, so what other age recommendations have shown up since 1979, and when were they introduced? And when did bar codes start appearing on packages?

I can hardly wait to see! Does she have a gallery?

More non-marble items which could be had from the Gropper Onyx Marble Co.: Gropper Onyx Marble Co playing cards w/ box . . (that's the description in a Jerry Stichter auction announcement)

Publications of the Gropper Onxy Marble Co., New York: Parlor and Lawn Croquet, ca. 1930. . . (source: Croquet World Online) Run straight to your library!

Advertising: As usual, this is a work in progress. I still have a few links to add, but there may be many I have overlooked. All corrections and additons are appreciated. And in this case, I enthusiastically encourage you to create more threads for me to add to the list! I would love to see more of those old ads. Note: LOM in front of a link indicates that the linked page is hosted by LandOfMarbles.com. MM indicates a link at Marble Mental. KC is the Kansas City Marble Collectors Club. Akron is AkronMarbles.com. "See also" will direct you elsewhere on the world wide web. Wide ranging discussions and examples Akro Timeline Ad Heaven Catalogs, brochures, company mailings, etc.: Howde They Get This One By Me (Ravenswood Catalog mention) Ravenswood Catalogs, authentic or Repro? Mostly Pix - Ravenswood (Pix from one of the auctions in the preceding link.) Some Onyx Marbles For Sale, "CHEAP!!" (1933 ad) Green Brick?? (scan from 1920's Montgomery Ward catalog in Post #29) There was a mention once of discussion of old catalogs seen in a Holland museum. Akron: What exactly is an Akro Agate Imperial (Source of the photo in the preceding link) Akro Ades, And Some Misconceptions.... (Akro catalog pages in Post #9.) More Marble Mail!!! (Akro ad in Post #11, from the same catalog?) MM: PeeWee Master Made Marbles (Reference to 1932 MM ad shown in American Machine-Made Marbles) KC: New Marble Catalogs (Vacor, Mega, House of Marbles) Akron: Image of brochure for "The New Akro Carnelian" (See more on Akronmarbles' Akro Agate Co. page.) Vienna Vitros !!! Blackies ad shown in many threads: Promotional Packaging: Starkey-Klicker (discussion) MM: Free Marbles! (A treasure trove of promotional packaging!) (see also Original Packaging thread ... will probably import some of those links here later) Printing on marbles: Printed Marbles (where to get them) Logo Marbles??? (Sistersville Fest marbles) Rare!, & unusual (Advertising Sulphide, Samuel Brothers of London) CATS?, New or old shooters, or Germans? (German Sparkler in Post #19 says Bonux) MM: Is the Porcelfrit question settled? Golden Rule marbles: A classic with several incarnations, sometimes used in advertising, sometimes not. Dilemma (References broken links; I'll try to smooth that out) Other cool items: Sam Dyke Miniature Jugs....

My thumbnails aren't working now. I need to change the code. Sources of pix are included when I know them. Here is a stupendous Ravenswood thread: Ravenswood Novelty Marbles - A Review Of Varieties Next, a catalog with Buddy bags, Paul Bunyans, and Assorted Colors. Polyethylene bags. Leader boxes. Also note the Buddy box in the pic, similar but not identical to the assorted colors box in the catalog. (click to enlarge) And close-ups of the bag which was sold with them: (click to enlarge) (source) Note: There may be other Ravenswood pix in the links here: Compilation: Original Packaging Links: Ravenswood Novelty Works

There have been a couple of others posted on the board. A very early bag from Al in Post #40 here, Marbles From Oregon - Cac Flame?, still Vitro Agate, but now a "Division of Jabo". A later bag from Trevor/Trexohio here, Original Jabo Bag. I have also presumed this Presidential Marble Collector Set to be "original packaging". Is it?

Don't know if this says anything but I thought it might be interesting to look at the Gropper box up against a set of Akros. . . (original akro photo) I like how "standard" the contents of the Gropper box appear. If it is backfilled, then at least to my untrained eye it seems that whoever filled it did a good job of making the marbles look as if they belong together. And I like the how roughly the same proportions of colors were used in both boxes, with the necessary exception of having to reduce one color to accomodate the aquas. It's a romantic notion, but I want that box to someday be found to be entirely original. If those are Akros in the Gropper box, I want it to be learned someday that for some reason Gropper was also a distributor of Akros. Say, when Akro switched over to corkscrews and patches ... perhaps they still had slags onhand but no interest in distributing them ... so they sold the surplus to Gropper. Just wishing ...

I now realize this will never be "everybody". It's not even all the threads and names on board yet, though. So I'll keep looking! See also the Glass Addiction forum, http://glasswizzards.yuku.com. Here is a list at Glass Addiction of contemporary marble makers. Trying to keep it current. Around 400 names at present. Do have a few more names to add already. How many names would I have had ... Contemporary Artists: Wide-ranging displays and discussions: Contemps How Interested Are You In Contemporary Marbles? Furnace Vs. Lamp? Wheaton (nj) Marble Show, It's not JUST contemporaries!!! Glass Addiction: What is a Filigrana ? (Nifty discussion of cane styles) Brian Bowden: Marble & Glass Demos - Brian is a major collector and moderator of Glass Addiction. These is his gallery with photos of glass artists at work. Glass Addiction: Marbles from 2009 Glass Addiction: Glassmaking communities Unidentified Contemps: Watermelon?? (sulphide) NOWHERE NEAR COMPLETE LIST OF NAMES. Trying to decide whether to delete all the names I don't have links for because it looks sort of cluttered, and the list will never be complete. But having trouble committing to deleting names. :-) James Alloway: Michael S. Barton: I Got Bit Buy The Copperheads Too!, Mikey's Copperheads Bit By The Copperheads Again! Mikey Barton's Marbles......., are Da BOMB!! (original pix are gone; Mike shows one in Post #6.) Artsy Fartsy Bartsy Marbles, new ones "bocciballs", by Michael Barton Everybody Needs Some!, Check out my new Mikey Barton's Marbles! Folded Swirls, trying to learn my new camera Sunshine And Aventurine, a good combo Got Mica ?, mmm ... sparkly Mike Barton's First Tornado With Mica I Finally Got Some Time See also: Barton Art Glass Works Troy Bennett: Laura Berretti: Strange Marble... See also: Marbled Marbles at Land of Marbles Jerry Capel: Mark Capel: Andy Davis: Delilah Davis: Jeramy ?: Jim Davis: Rick Davis: Steve Davis: Mike Edmondson: I Finally Got Some Time Douglas Ferguson: Jody Fine: Drew Fritts: Ashley (Genovini) Galaites: In My Top 5 Favorite Contemporary Collection John Gentile: Misha, Matt and Brishen Giesler: See also: Eugene Rain Mike Gong: See also: ... through the fume (his blog) Brian Graham: The only one outside of captivity...... See also: The Akron Marbles Store Sara and Andy Gregorich: Greg Hoglin: J. R. Hooper: Other Side Of The Coin. (miniature marbles) Sammy Hogue: Trying To Find Marco Jerman: See also: Jerman Art Glass Zach Jorgenson: Marble Player Contemp See also: Lazuli Flux Chris and Lissa Juedemann Furnace Vs. Lamp? (see Post #6) See also: Glass Kitchen Studio Penny Kelley: Jerry Kelly: Robert LaGrand: Ray Laubs: Birdcages? Do You Have Any? Rays Sulphides Robert Livezey: John McCormick: Shamrock Rocks Shamrock Marbles Some Late Kc Pictures (picture of John and his machine) Blue Ray...no Way....???? Nadine MacDonald: Steve Maslach: Mark Matthews: Snapshots From Kc Marble Show 2007 John Hamon Miller: Kevin Nail: Contemp Collectors Filigranos... And Some Others See also: Kevin's gallery at GlassArtists.org Shannon Norris: Jerry Park: A Couple Of New Contemps., Any ideas? Kris Parke: Scott Patrick: George Pavliscak: Pavliscak Studios Live Auction - Sunday Feb 25th 5pm, Marbles and other cool stuff See also: Pavliscak Studios Michael Petura: Is Clear A Color ? Surfs Up ! Gallery: World's Best (Modern) Guineas Julia Powell: Trying To Find Gregg Pessman: Steve Powers: Ro Purser: Chris Robinson: David Rosenfeldt: Josh Sable: David Salazar: The Mailman Has Arrived Contemp Experts??, Any idea who made this one?? Joe Schlemmer: See also: MadManMarbles Kelly Schmidt: Who Did It? Eddie Seese: Eddie Seese Rainbow Twister (for Sue) See also: Eddie Seese Art Glass Marbles Josh Simpson: New Purchase, Josh Simpson paperweight Josh Simpson Planets See also: Josh Simpson Contemporary Glass Paul Stankard: Bo Stiff: Marble Mail Loren Stump: See also: Stumpchunk Gallery Bill Tow: Bt Marbles On Ebay...., Not an everyday opportunity!!! Transparents.. Bill Tow Marbles!! Wooo Hoooo!!!, Ya Gotta Luv'em!! See also: MARBLELAIRIUM and Bill Tow's Gallery at GlassArtists.org Teign Valley Glass: Any info on this House of Marbles handmade Vacor? See also: House of Marbles & Teign Valley Glass Tom Thornburgh: Kenen Tiemeyer: Kenen Tiemeyer! What A Class Act! See also: Kenan Tiemeyer's gallery Chad Trent: Daniel Trilli: Daniel Trilli Brice Turnbull: See also: Hammerlane Glass Tim Waugh: Rolf and Genie Wald: Jane Walker: Travis Weber: Travis Weber Marbles How Interested Are You In Contemporary Marbles? Some Pictures Of My Latest Marbles See also: Weber Glass Steve Willis: What Kind Of Peltiers Are These? (Cosmic Storm in Post #3)

Moss Agates How many types of Moss Agate have there been? (officially or otherwise) Kids played with 'em in 1883. Benningtons with shades of brown and green. These have some blue, but they'll do until I find a closer example. . . (murmelwelt.de) MFC made them. This statement was on Marblealan's M. F. Christensen page: Here is Bill Tow's moss agate avatar: And of course there's Akro: Any others? Oh yes, there are rocks: . . (Wikipedia) Any more?

Beyond the essential marble pages Links, many of us have found special favorites. Here are some of mine ... "only" the David Chamberlain articles for now ... I look at those so often I need to have them handy! Feel free to add yours. One at a time or in groups, organized in themes or random, with comments or without. I'll leave them as you present them (won't try to merge them into my list). Speaking of offsite treasures though ... have you see the updates at MarbleAlan.com? Looking good! David Chamberlain's articles at Marble Mental Champion Agate Company Cairo Novelty Company, Cairo, WV (1946-1952) ALLEY AGATE COMPANY Heaton Agate Company, Cairo, WV Alox Manufacturing Co., St. Louis, Missouri Ravenswood Novelty Company, Ravenswood, WV Jackson Marble Company, East Pennsboro, WV C.E. Bogard & Sons Cat's Eye Marbles, Cairo, WV Root Beer Floats, Novas, and Pink Champagnes, Peltier Marble Company Jabo 2003 Fall Classics Jabo, Inc., Reno, Ohio, 2005 Marble Production Jabo 2006 Article by David Chamberlain Jabo Southwestern Style 2005 Additional articles are added from time to time. And links have been known to change. There's a summary of available articles in the archives at Marble Mental: David Chamberlain articles

(click pix to enlarge) Acme Realers Maybe you knew this, maybe you didn't ... Before Acme was comedy . . (1) (2) it meant the very best, the highest point, perfection! . . (ads from 1902 and WWII) So what do you name an "extra high quality" glass orb with "genuine onyx color with cloud effects in contrasting colors" and a "real" marbled base? What better than Acme? (Love that ad! The realer is from PeltierMarbles.com.)

The sentiment on that one seemed mixed. (I was rooting for vintage. :-) This box doesn't have the looks-too-new problem. So it's basically a nice but worn old box from a company with somewhat unclear jobbering practices. With a nice set of basically matching yet nondescript slags in safe slag colors. Nice assortment of colors, beyond the basic MFC palette, but nothing fancy. Definitely no extra CAC colors beyond the Akro palette. (edit: I'm sure my summary shows my bias toward the possibility of authenticity, but is it about right?) The marbles are between 21/32" and 11/16". Does that mean anything? Like how hard would someone nowadays have to work to backfill it with marbles of consistent size, coloration and swirl? and would it be worth the effort?

Reliable sources confirm that there is reason to question whether the contents are Peltier. That leaves me wondering about the significance of "Factory, Ottawa" on the box. Since the owner says this box doesn't have any extra labelling warning people that those are glass marbles not actually onyx, one might hypthesize that these were packaged prior to 1931. (Gropper lost the lawsuit mentioned here, Misleading Naming Of Marbles, (didn't start with eBay). ) However I also hypothesized a Peltier connection for the contents based on the "Factory, Ottawa" statement, so I am now shy about all of these assumptions. Where did Gropper's jobber enterprise begin?

This 40-count box says I asked the owner if there was any printing on the box other than on the side of the lid showing. She said there was not. She states their size as .666 to .680 inches. When I saw "Factory, Ottawa", I assumed they were Peltiers. Then I noticed the row of white slags. So, who made these?

incredible

'salright! I'm happy. (thanks)

Most or all from recent eBay auctions (click to enlarge pix) Marvellous Value, the "No Better" Box of Marbles: Brilliant Marbles, Wonderful Value: More lutz. Older than the box before? Crocheted bags: Pink: Deutsches Roulette. Look at how the marbles' core resembles the flag on the box top. That is not an accident. "Schwarz , Weiss, Rot" means "Black, White, Red".

From German marble sites A few items from murmelwelt.de. Several more at the site. (click to enlarge) A pair of mesh bags from among the many things to be viewed at maerbelmuehle.de, the website of the Thuringen Marble Museum. Colorful earthenware and wirepulls. I'm curious about the age on the earthenware and the mesh bag.

I may come back and edit this to make it sound more "official"! But I want to say now, if you have any eggheady stuff you'd like to add in here, feel free. Any projects you'd like to tinker on as you feel inspired. Pictures from your marble digs. Example pix in any germane category! Pontil studies. Slag color studies! "Lessons" about your favorite marbles. Unusual marble references you think worthy of note, and worthy of not ending up on the back pages as fast as they would in chat. Your own lists of useful links! (My W.I.P. will thank you, because it is still debating what to include.) Or ... ? I'm sure there won't be a stampede to post! But you're welcome anytime. Steph p.s. If you want to follow-up on any existing topics, it's okay to bump threads in general. Or start a new one, whichever you prefer. But if someone is working on a technical thread and you aren't sure whether it's open for discussion, play it safe. Start your own thread for the follow-up or check with the author to see if it's okay to add to theirs. p.p.s. It's always okay to bump my threads. Good for their circulation. ;-)

It sounds like marbles sellers were fairly careful with their labelling by 1933. In that year you could buy Glass Onyx Marbles, Glass Agates and Imitation Carnelians. And of course Imitation Agates, but Bennies were already being called that in the 1870's. Some Onyx Marbles For Sale, "CHEAP!!"

Akro, MFC and Peltier all called their slags onyx. This is my book report on the subject. I never learned whether CAC called their slags anything other than Toy Marbles as seen in Post #8 here, One Killer Box Of Really Big C.a. Slags:-). MFC had already been out of business 13 years in 1930 but even after Akro stopped making slags it still used the name Onyx for one of its cork lines. Edited: The name "onyx" was so widely known for toy marbles that at least four companies used it over the course of about two decades before the FTC complaint. That seems like a long time to wait before complaining. And it hardly seems likely that after all those years of playing with and breaking glass marbles, the public would think those particular onyxes were rocks. That's really weird, Roger. Still cool to know. But really weird.