jeroen

Hello, I got information from my friend, who told me that manganese is the cause of the clowing under a blacklight. Just like Hansel said. Until about 1880 manganese was a compontent of the glass. Afterwards it was no longer in the glass, at least not enough to have that glowing effect unde a blacklight. Jeroen

Hello Hansel, Thank you for your wise words. I have asked Jeroen van Valkenburg, if het can explain the blacklight issue and the glowing in the dark. I have seen that difference myself at his home between an old faceted swirl, and a Joseph Coat. He is an archaeologist from profession, and has a lot of knowledge about old glass. He can explain it better than I can. As for the right name for this group.... The main difference between the Leighton marbles is the type of pontil. So faceted pontil hand gathered would be a good name. And if the Greiner were the only ones who made glass marbles in that period, we could also call them hand gathered Greiners. After the invention of the marble scissors, most marbles were cane cut marbles, but single gathered were still produced. I think the single pontil end of day marbles were also a kind of single gathered. Made from glass that was left over at the end of the day? Gatherd together to create an single gather marble. Correct me if I am wrong. So a name is not so easy, but if a name covers 99% of all the marbles that were produced, I think we made good progress. Any other suggestions for names ar welcome of course. Jeroen

Hello, A very nice marble! I would call it shrunken core, allthough mildly shrunken;-) I have an 12 lobed with exact the same color combination. It has the few red spots also. it is just over 2-3/8 inch. See the photo. They could be from the same maker. Is your onionskin perhaps for sale, or trade? I would love it to have a similar onionskin in my collection. They would make a nice pair. Regards, Jeroen

Hello, Thank you for this interesting information. I have discussed about my artible with Jeroen van Valkenburg, who has a lot of knowledge about old handmade marbles. He told me that years ago he had conversations with late Alan Basinet about these kind of marbles. It would be interesting to know if there is indeed not only a difference between faceted pontils for the old single gathered handmade, and non faceted for the Leighton types, but also if there is a good difference between them, on how they react under a black light. I hope there is someone with both Leighton, and the old faceted types, and put them together under a blacklight. If this is done in a dark place, the old one should glow greenish, and the Leighton not. Jeroen

And some more examples. The green one and the yellow one are 1-9/16 inch. The others are about 7/8 inch. Jeroen

Hello, I promesed. to post an article about this subject, so here it is. Transitionals marbles or single gather handmade marbles. I hope with this article to start a discussion about the group of marbles that are known as transitional marbles, such as those from Leighton and Navarre. But in this group are also marbles that in my opinion, and I spoke with other collectors also, do not belong to the Transitional marbles. I want to call them single gather handmade marbles. The Leighton transitionals are in my opinion the true transtitional marbles because they were produced in the period that can be seen as a transition from hand made to machine made glass marbles. (although handmade marbles were produced in Germany until the 1920’s, long after the start of the Leighton transitionals) But if you read Paul Baumann’s Collecting antique marbles 4th edition, page 116-121, one can read that it is not clear what kind of Marbles Leighton made, because he worked for many glass factories. Perhaps he did not make any marble at all! The single gather handmade marbles that I speak of are different. Some features of the single gather handmade marbles are: - often a nine pattern, and a strong twist of the colored glass - often as made blowout holes at the surface - very well made faceted pontils. These pontils are often so well made that they are hardly visible. Showing that people back than took a lot of time and effort, to finish off these marbles as nice as possible. Probably because these glass marbles had to compete with the agate marbles from Idar Oberstein, which were very popular in those times. Another evidence of the old age of these marbles is, that they are glowing greenish in the dark when hold under a black light. This phenomenon I caused by radio active particles in the glass. These particles affect the glass after a long time period. Usually this start after 100 years. It can be seen with the earliest hand made marbles. You won’t see it with Joseph coats, because they were produced in the 1910-1920 period, and are not old enough to glow under a black light. The single gather handmade marbles glow very strong, indicating that the glass is old. Before these single gather marbles, there were stoneware marbles, like those from Rearen and Frechen. They started to produce them from about 1550. So after a very long period, the single gather marbles were the first glass marbles that were produced after a very long period. So transitional is not the right name for these marbles. There is strong evidence these single gather marbles were produced in Germany, probably as early as 1820. A single gather marble was found in the Netherlands in the ground together with a coin dated 1837. These single gather marbles have been found in the ground in the Lauscha area in Germany as well. This is a strong indication that they were produced in Germany, and not in the USA. On the website http://www.knikkerwereld.nl is more information about these old single gather marbles. The next part is an translation from Dutch into English, made with google translation, so excuses for the errors: The Romans invented them (probably the Egyptians), but the "breakthrough" was in Thuringia. Around 1830 they tried to create marbles from a resource that is literally for the taking: glass. They wanted to compete with the agate marbles from Idar Oberstein, which were very popular at that time, but had one major drawback, they were expensive. The first marbles were made in a way in which the tip of a glass rod is heated, so that it became viscous. The viscous mass was then pushed in, specially made wooden molds. By slightly turning the rod, the mold was well filled. Then, the mold was separated from the rod and allowed to cool. Then the mold was removed and the glass marble was created, which, however, still had to be updated manually, because this method left many bumps on the marble. All this took far too long, the production was too low, there must be created an alternative. These early marbles are now very rare and therefore very popular with collectors. In 1848 Elias Greiner invented the marble scissors. This was the end of these handmade single gather marbles. After the Romans made glass marbles about 2000 years ago, probably the single gather marbles from the Lauscha area were the first marbles that were produced at larger quantities. There are some 15th century glass marbles from Venice. A few of those marbles can be seen in the Murano glass museum. As far as I know Leighton transitionals don’t have a faceted pontil, but a melted pontil. The Navarre marbles have the same kind of melted pontil. If there are Leighton marbles with a faceted pontil, the check with a blacklight can show if the glass is old or not. The single gather handmade marbles come in several sizes, ranging from 5/8 to over 1-1/2 inch. The more colors the more valuable. I think this is a very nice group of marbles, and because these are the earliest German handmade glass marbles, they deserved to get the correct name, which is derived of how they were made. Perhaps I have overseen things that might be of influence of my ideas, that these old marbles are indeed single gather handmade marbles. Things that might be in contradiction, or support these ideas. I hope to hear it from you. So I hope to start a transition as to speak, to change the name for those old handmade marbles from transitional marbles into single gather handmade marbles. Because that is what they are in my opinion! Jeroen

Inmagine the little boy who opened his birthday present 130-150 years ago, and he saw that marble, and held it in his hands. (but perhaps his father said.. and now you put it in the cabinet, and never touch it agian ;-) )

Hello Marble collectors, I have some marbles for sale one ebay. Check this out: http://www.ebay.com/sch/dutchmarbles/m.html?item=321015945258&pt=Marbles&hash=item4abe0a982a&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2562 Perhaps there is something that has your interest. Regards, Jeroen

Hello, I noticed that pink opaque lutzes are hot and will bring some good money. I have one in a drawer that I picked up last year at a flea marked. Not nice enough for in my showcase. It is not a realy big one, just over 2 inches diameter....Any one interested? Bids are welcome ;-) Jeroen

Hello marble collectors My name is Jeroen Pater. I am 42 years old (just for one more day though), married with Petra, and I have a son Bart who is 7 years old, and a daughter Sofie who is 2 years old. I work as a forester at the Dutch Forestry Commission. I studied at the forestry school. We don’t have a lot forests in Holland (like the USA), so there is only one such school in Holland. Beside old marbles my other great hobby are ancient trees, old and large trees in Europe. I collect historical information about them, like old photo’s, books etc. And of course I visit them and make photos. I have written a book about old trees which was published in 2006. In Dutch, French and German Language. If you google “Les arbres remarquables d'Europe” or “Europas alte Bäume, Ihre Geschichten, ihre Geheimnisse” you will find my book. I started collect old marbles when I was a young boy. At primary school I always tried to trade the modern marbles for old ones. I remembered that one time I trade 110 modern marbles for one old one. An absurd number, but I like that old one very much. After primary school I lost my interest in marbles. Sold the new ones I won during all the years of marble playing, but I always kept the old ones. My interest in old marbles started again in 2004. When I build a new house on the place where the house of my grandfather stood, I found a big 4.5 cm salt glazed stoneware marble. It looked very nice, and I wondered what it was. I asked several people, and it turned out to be a 400 year old marble made in Raeren or Frechen in Germany. I started to collect more of them. And of course I was interested if they could be found in other countries too. So in 2008 I think I looked at ebay.com if thei were for sale in the USA too. I first had to find out what the English name for “knikker” was. Then I saw for the first time the old handmade German marbles. I was struck by there beauty, and was surprice that some of those marbles were so big. But I also saw the prices one had to pay, to buy a nice large marble. The stoneware marbles were much cheaper. I decided first that those marbles were to expensive for me, and left them alone. But I could not get them out of my mind. I noticed that the salt glazed stoneware marbles were very rare in the USA. I could not find them on ebay. So I thought perhaps I could sell some to get money to buy the old German handmade marbles. So in 2010 I came in contact with late Alan Basinet. I spoke with him and we agreed that he would try to sell some of my stoneware marbles. He also told me that there was a Dutch collector with a very good collection of marbles and great knowledge of old handmade marbles, Jeroen van Valkenburg. Alan expected that my stoneware marble would sell rather good, but in the end they did just so so. I think the average price they sell for was about $50. In the mean time I had a lot of contact with Jeroen vV. He told me that he hand polished old marbles too. So in November 2010 I bought my first big marble. A pretty beaten up onionskin for $80. Even in the bad state it was I was very pleased when I opened the package. I never held such a big 2-1/4 inch marble in my hand before. Something a little boy would dream of. I brought it to Jeroen vV. I could take a look at his fantastic collection too. Well he polished it, and it became a pretty marble. (see photos my first onionskin before and after buffing) Slowly I start to learn a little about the old handmade German marbles. I noticed that in my collection of old marbles from primary school I had 6 or 7 of those old marbles, all latticinio types. In the mean time I have bought some other marbles too for my collection. I have managed to find a way to get some money with buy and selling some kind of Spanish lego building bricks. Here in Holland it is possible to buy them cheap, and in Spain they get crazy about it. So here you see me with my small but fine collection. For only two years of serious collecting old hand made marbles that is not so bad I think. So I think everybody can guess that my preference are old handmade marbles. With best regards, Jeroen

Hello, I asked my friend Jeroen van Valkenburg about that catalog, and that catalog is most likely from after 1900. Beside that, the Germans started to produce the first machine made slags in the early 1900. Those marbles are shown on that catalog. The single gathered are much older. Jeroen van Valkenburg told me he found one in the ground in the Netherlands during archaeological excavations together with a coin dated 1837. Both were in the same soil level. There is other proof that marbles were made before 1850 or 1860. In 1848 Elias Greiner invented the marble scissor. See this link http://www.knikkerwereld.nl/glas.php. Translate it with google translator in English. Het got patent for it on September 5th of that year. I don't think he invented this scissor and got patent for it, to produce glass bottles. I have also heard of a sulphide marble with a coin (not a metal coin of course) in it dated 1855. But I asked my friend to help me with this article and I hope there is some more proof of marbles dated from before 1860. Perhaps other collectors out there can help. Regards, Jeroen

This is one of my best marbles, a 1-9/16 inch single hand gather. The size of this one is rare for this kind of marbles. They are also called transitional marbles, but they are not. I will post an article about these group of marbles later. This marble is probably made in the period 1830-1840. It has a very smooth faceted pontil. The base glass is green. I am curious if some of you have similar marbles. Regards, Jeroen

Hello marble collectors, Again I have some interesting marbles for sale on ebay: http://www.ebay.com/sch/dutchmarbles/m.html?item=320986682777&pt=Marbles&hash=item4abc4c1599&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2562 Regards, Jeroen

Hello marble collectors, Chech this out: http://morphyauctions.auctionflex.com/showlots.ap?co=31120&weid=26780&weiid=0&archive=n&lso=lotnumasc&pagenum=1〈=En It is the new morphy marble auction. Regards, Jeroen Pater

Hello marble Collectors, If you like joseph coat marbles, take a look at my ebay auctions. There are several lots for sale, some are very nice, and wet mint too. There are other types of marbles too. http://www.ebay.com/sch/dutchmarbles/m.html?hash=item4abb7c7440&item=320973075520&pt=Marbles&rt=nc&_trksid=p4340.l2562 http://www.ebay.com/itm/nice-group-of-5-joseph-coats-4-of-them-submarine-style-/320973075520?pt=Marbles&hash=item4abb7c7440 Jeroen

I am not so into the machine made marbles, but wow!, this is a very nice group! Jeroen

Hello Randy, Thank you for your post. I have just send you an e-mail. look forward to hear from you. Jeroen

Hello,An 2-11/16 inch 12 lobed onionskin! That is a marble I would die for. I hope you can post some photos soon. Jeroen

Hello,Can you post some photos of that giant, or send photos to my email address paterjb01(at) gmail dot com I would love to see them. And what do you mean with vane? lobed? Jeroen

I run into a 2-5/8 inch onionskin that was sold in 1996 for $3050. I am affraid to long ago that anyone can remember on what auction it was, or have more deatails than this website gives. http://www.kovels.com/Price-Guide/Toys-Dolls-Price-Guide/Marble.html?eid=68828 Jeroen

Hello, Recently I found a super marble. It is a wet mint 2-7/16 inch 12 lobed single pontil single gather mica onionskin. It has about all a great marble should have. The condition is perhaps the most rare of this marble. A very well known top collector has held this marble in his hands too, and this is what he wrote me. "The marble arrived. It's just a tad under 2 7/16" and in as good condition as I've seen in any marble. i.e. 9.9 or even 10.0! When it arrived and I held it in my hands, it looked like a shiny diamond. Never seen such a large handmade in this kind of condition. Enjoy the photos, and I look forward to your reactions. Jeroen

Hello Collectors, I have some interesting old handmade marbles for sale on ebay. Especially the small lobed Joseph Coat is someting special. Jeroen http://www.ebay.com/itm/320952689984?ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1558.l2649 http://offer.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewBids&item=320952678344&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:BIDN&_trksid=p3984.m1558.l2765 http://www.ebay.com/itm/320951674528?ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1558.l2649 http://www.ebay.com/sch/dutchmarbles/m.html?item=320952702648&sspagename=STRK%3AMESELX%3AIT&rt=nc&_trksid=p3984.m1558.l2649&_trksid=p4340.l2562

Hello, I am not calling any one a liar. I thought it would just be intersting to know, if more of such jumbo onionskins do exist. And who can tell for sure the other people are right about Les Jones marbles. It is not easy to tell just buy looking at a mable how big it actually is. A large marble with a shrunken core might look smaller than one of the exact same size with the appearance of the colored glass just under the surface. In one book I remember that such a kind of onionskin is called a bowling ball, because the look very large, because the colored glass seems to be just under the surface.I hope we are not finished yet with this subject. More information about jumbo onionskins is welcome! Jeroen

Hello, I got an reaction from Bill, and het saw all of Les marbles, but non of them was above 2-1/2 inch. It seems those extra large over 2-1/2 inch ones are rarer than we might think.Jeroen

Hello,I asked Hansel before, but as far as I remembered he has no information of the existence of 3 inch jumbo onionskins. I don't know who Hipocritter is, but he is welcome to tell me what he knows. Jeroen