honeybern

Hater! lol

You don't have to apologize & the 12 yr old thing was a low blow - I mean I am only 12 but, after all, I will be attending Harvard Law School! I tried to tell grams but she's big on kicking them when they're down. Go figure. Back on topic: I have never seen a marble machine other than drawings on file at the patent office and some Jabo machines running in a dark YouTube video but I know chaos theory and for anyone to be able to duplicate all the factors that total any CAC with more than 2 colors amid all the chaos that's going on in the machine, anyone trying would stand a better chance of being hit by lightning, three times, than pulling this off. I believe that anyone who owns marble making machinery knows this and that is why they are too busy making marbles to fool with anything like counterfeiting another maker's stuff. The investment in time and material would be huge just to try with no idea of when, if ever, they'd succeed - is this really a serious topic??? Not IMO it isn't.

LOL! It's hard to tell cuz its always like that! (this) I'm (Jon) not allowed to post unless grams is right on it. Except this post and one's like it cuz it doesn't express an opinion which is the only kind of post I'm allowed when grams is snoring like now.

Just kidding about the "12 yr old" thing. I mean I am only 12 but I don't have to hide behind that just to spar with you. Shamrocks can't fool anyone not because of palate, though they haven't matched, and I think it's on purpose, CACs. And it's not about pattern. It's the combination of seams and surface. Under a 10X loupe - Shamrock's not even in the same hemisphere seam-wise. Under a 30x loupe the difference in surfaces is literally night and day. In fact, IMO, not even close with the naked eye. So as far as myself and the < 6 CAC collectors I know (they live under my bed where they also collect dust motes), Shamrock is a non-issue. Re: employees taking marbles home: WHAT???

Big man - (o so sorry, big MON) picking on a 12 yr old! WTG tough guy! - Jon That's what bullies do I guess, go for the littlest since anything more would just chop down whatever atoms of self esteem they're still desperately, clinging to. - Honeybern

Both! We're double-teaming the forum - I'm (Jon) at the kb, grams in her shiney, new, Monarch Royal , right behind me, over my shoulder. Why do you ask, pray tell?

My CAC exotics. Not exotics? Fine. Call 'em whatever you want - everyone else will probably be calling em whatever you think they should be called - eventually, for a while, at least. They're still CACs and God ain't makin' any more of 'em. OOPS lower left is just this cool brick with purple and top row whatever from left (about middle) is just a purple slag or transparent swirl (in case Steph sees this) maybe not even CAC - how'd they get in the shot?

I say, "hooey"! See pics in my post, above-those are the marbles in question. Not CACs? They are to all the tip-top authorities. What have you got? Unsubstantiated accusations - no not even accusations - that would take more guts - "I say follow the money for the true answer to this debate. It always comes down to that in the end.", what is that? Indirect, slithery innuendo casting a funky light in the general direction of those you envy? Pitiful! Get a life, then keep it to yourself!

Re: "The ignored stuff: show me anything proving that the marbles in question aren't CACs. The only evidence I've ever seen, and keep seeing, confirms that they are CAC's. I have posted evidence in my previous post dispelling the post 2000 dig emergence of these marbles. Who are Art's marble people? Who's Ken and Bill and VT's Thelma and where are their pics? Maybe ask them to post here. In the meantime,I'll post the other CAC color plate from Baumann's with more exotics (published in Sept, 1999) listed under "diaper folds" and "slags and swirls". But for now, heres some Pics from Lucht's A. Fiedler book - exotoics all:

Because the sellers that salt a few WV Swirls and white based Corks into their, otherwise, totally worthless lots of Peltier rainbos and baseballs, un-noteworthy catseyes new All Reds and a few Vacors don't need to invest in an exotic to sucker buyers into bidding up their listings. And whats all this about this dig in 2000 as the Genesis of exotics? They're just striped opaques, striped transparents and submarines (maybe guineas, too). Where's the mystery or controversy? In Baumann's 3rd ed: published 09/01/1999, Baumann acknowledges Brian Estepp: for loaning the marbles pictured in the color plate section of that fine tome (I couldn't post the second page due to the 500K max/post).: several of which are the same, exact, CAC's I've seen and bid on(and won a few) on eBay, consistently offered at a rate of one to three, or so, a week there. Marblealan sells them on consignment pretty regularly since May that I know of - usually one or two each week but I haven't seen him use "exotic" in his listings descriptions and why would he? They seem to sell fine without the controversial moniker "I pity the foo' what tries to tell Mr Estepp he been buyins fakeries!!" - Mr T

Bitchen! Has anyone seen one before? How about one that primo?

Now THAT'S a relevant analogy if ever I heard one! Did you profit on the trade right away? Did you have to hold on to them for a while? Or do you still have them?

I love it!!! All the proof I need! I've about 10 of these - my newest and new favorite one arriving today - a nice variety. The new one wasn't offered by Alan so got it for under $200. I was thrilled having placed a high bid early on for about $300 All the serious CAC collectors I know (3 or 4) are convinced and willing to pay way more than me, at this point. Under big big magnification, the structure of the exotic is indistinguishable from any other, universally-accepted-to-be-genuine CAC. I think the labor involved in faking one would be so great, any marble maker would be better off to make what he usually makes which may sell for less but wouldn't have to pass a barrage of scrutiny/sweat the pressure of having to pass off the "fake" once finished. I'm much more concerned over guinea purchases than these. And no matter what, I think people will continue to trade in these and prices will go up if for no other reason than sufficient numbers of collectors are interested enough to keep pressure on demand. Maybe they only do want to believe it but that's been working for Jesus and several others for thousands of years, in some cases. After all, the Emperor's new clothes were real enough for some time and you can actually see and hold these marbles.

And even today, in Burma you can be caned or even imprisoned for being caught in possession of hybrid catseyes!* *Please excuse the appearance of this marble, but I was just in Burma where I helped this marble escape to the West. It was rescued in the same fashion that made it out of Viet Nam and we hadn't time to clean up, sufficiently,before being photographed.

And weren't 19 men and women accused, tried, convicted and hung in 1692 in Salem MA for being hybrid catseyes fanciers?

Whoa! Wasn't the Marquis de Sade first jailed in 1768 after he procured the services of a woman, Rose Keller and then took her to his chateau at Arcueil, imprisoning her there and subjecting her to unnatural views of hybrid catseyes? She escaped by climbing out of a second-floor window and running away.

So, what's not to like? Anyone looking at these beautiful marbles shouldn't like them? And who would that be? And for this, you need comments? OK! Your new marbles are beautiful! Boy o boy did you ever get some beautiful marbles! Kenahora! Pu-pu-pu! I should be so lucky! You should be enjoying them in good health! Oy vey now those are marbles!!! Mozel tov! My bill you'll receive via PM.

The squirrel was probably using the marbles as decoys to protect his nuts.

Didn't the list view of threads used to include the thread starter? I can't figure which threads I want to look at.

Uh, huh, would have been kind a hard to kid about ballast, not knowing what it was. "Kidding" cuz they probably didn't tumble or otherwise fashion ballast into perfect spheres which would render them impractical, besides the fact that they probably didn't have tumblers unless there were water or air powered ones. Or powered by slaves or like the Flintstones with pet dinosaurs n stuff. But I don't think we saw any dinosaur powered machines at the Creation Museum, come to think of it, which seems odd, considering how easy it was to saddle dinosaurs and ride them around when they weren't being eaten by them, that is. <br><br><br><br><br>Edit: perhaps dinosaurs, due to the lack of good dentists, developed a very regular diet so as not to jeopardize their teeth through the additional wear and tear from in-between-meal noshing and the additional plague build up, etc. After all a dinosaur's teeth were very important to them since they didn't have, nor do they have to this day, opposing thumbs. People could have observed the dinosaurs dining schedule, and shared the information until everyone knew when it was safe to saddle up a T-Rex, for instance, and ride it around.<br>

I was kidding? Could be stone age marbles! Yeah, that's the ticket! The first mibs made by early man fashioned after the ones they observed being made by dung beetles. But, unlike the dung beetle's, the man mades were fashioned as components of various games of liesure and not the tasty, in-between-meal-snacks that the bipedal, hunter-gatherers informally referred to as "oop ips" which roughly translates to beetle balls.

Why don't the pics in post #4 enlarge?

The OP is dated today, why is it old? And isn't "greg11" kinna a funny handle for a tall fashion model type?

Marbles? Unusually spherical field stones? One of those, fer sure! I can't decide. Edit: I guess I could haul out Baumann's Collecting Antique Marbles or Gartley and Carskadden's Colonial Period and Early 19th Century Children's Toy Marbles but Lawdy I ain' gots de strenth!! Ballast?