lstmmrbls Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 I always considered the ground pontil marbles in this group pic onionskins. Are they???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ann Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 That's what I'd call them. What's the alternative? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lstmmrbls Posted July 13, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 Good question. But I keep hearing that onionskins are color banding and or splotches on a white(usually) layer is why I ask. These have only the layer of color banding which would classify them as Josephs Coats. I would have a problem calling them by that moniker . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
honeybern Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 Bottom left is an onionskin, others are Joseph's Coat's...according to Stanley (Antique Glass End of Day Marbles, Stanley Block) Pg 101: the defs being the same but with Joseph's Coats having "...at least one black or dark blue strand in the design." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
honeybern Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 Good question. But I keep hearing that onionskins are color banding and or splotches on a white(usually) layer is why I ask. These have only the layer of color banding which would classify them as Josephs Coats. I would have a problem calling them by that moniker . OK now I don't know anymore.... page 7: "END OF DAY - ONIONSKINS have an overall base color with streaks of one or more colors all over. For the most part, these colors run from pole to pole. Some of the colors look like an onionskin(sic), thus..." "END OF DAY JOSEPH'S COATS marbles are those with designs close to the surface and all around the marble. Usually containing multiple colors and at least one black..." Glad that's all cleared up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lstmmrbls Posted July 13, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 I would not put much value in Blocks descriptions. He made many of them up and has not updated them over the years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ann Posted July 13, 2011 Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 I would not put much value in Blocks descriptions . . . and has not updated them over the years. ^^^I agree. I just can't get the words "Joseph Coat" out of my mouth when I look at any of these. Best I can do is "Joseph Ccccc .... Cccccc ....ccccc" Nope. I totally understand (and more-or-less agree) about the undercoat/no undercoat thing, but for me both onionskins & JCs are equally about the appearance and arrangement of the color streaks/stripes -- enough for me to be able to disregard the "no undercoat" issue on these. If they were mine they'd be onionskins, for sure. PS: I'd also like to see the term "end-of-day" disappear . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lstmmrbls Posted July 13, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 13, 2011 We are thinking alike. Anyone else want to jump in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steph Posted July 14, 2011 Report Share Posted July 14, 2011 I'm kinda hoping Bob will! He's been a pretty active participant lately. Good chance he'll see this. ... said with respect and great interest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBlock Posted July 14, 2011 Report Share Posted July 14, 2011 From the Price Guide: JOSEPH’S COAT SWIRLS  Joseph’s Coat Swirls are swirls that have an outer layer of glass that is composed of variously colored similar-width complete strands, packed very closely together. Better examples have no clear spaces in between the strands. Some examples do have clear spaces, In some cases, theses appear to be part of the design. There are usually some strands in the inner core that can be seen through the spaces. Generally, the more colors in the marble, the more valuable it is. Joseph’s Coat Swirls have either dark, earthy colors or bright English-style colors. The base glass of a Joseph’s Coat can either be clear (#19, #20) or colored. The outer layer can be Swirl type (bands and strands) or End of Day type (stretched flecks of glass) (#21, #22).  FWIW, tbe term Joseph's Coat goes back to at least the mid 1980s, maybe earlier, before we wrote any of our books. The term originally applied to the colors that used to be called English or Bristol, though it seems to have expanded to cover other colors over the years. The term Clown is much more recent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marbles4Case Posted July 14, 2011 Report Share Posted July 14, 2011 Agreed, all four posted are Onionskins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBlock Posted July 14, 2011 Report Share Posted July 14, 2011 LOL, I happened to be eating dinner and cruising the Internet on my iPad at the dinner table. Don't tell my wife, she's in England visiting her sister Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBlock Posted July 14, 2011 Report Share Posted July 14, 2011 I realized that the text above references the image numbers in the new 5th edition, so you can't take the post above and go to the Price Guide you might have. The images corresponding to the text in my post above are: Image 19: Image 20: Image 21: Image 22: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ziggyzora Posted July 14, 2011 Report Share Posted July 14, 2011 FWIW, tbe term Joseph's Coat goes back to at least the mid 1980s, maybe earlier, before we wrote any of our books. The term originally applied to the colors that used to be called English or Bristol, though it seems to have expanded to cover other colors over the years. #1 I would also call onionskins but curious how some other marble terms came about, so a couple of questions if I may? What are the colors that used to be called English? and what are they now? How is Bristol involved? Is there any provenance to any of these terms? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
honeybern Posted July 15, 2011 Report Share Posted July 15, 2011 I would not put much value in Blocks descriptions. He made many of them up and has not updated them over the years. I thought I was being facetious. Edit: Images in post #13: Linkees no workee? So..............................are they all onion skins......or what? Price Guide 5th ed.: "Joseph's Coat Swirls are swirls that have an outer layer of glass that is composed of variously colored similar-width complete strands, packed very closely together." Price Guide 4th ed., page 24: "Joseph's Coat Swirls are swirls that have a sub-surface layer of glass that is composed of different colored strands, placed very closely together." According to all of the pics and descriptions of onion skins, joseph's coats, banded opaques, and end of days in the 4th ed of the price guide, any of these 4 names can be applied to any marble fitting any of the descriptions for all of the above. "A banded opaque has an opaque to transparent base glass." pg.34 "The base glass of a Joseph's coat can either be clear or colored" under Joseph's Coat Swirls and End of Days pg 24 ONIONSKIN - an end of day marble where the flecks of glass are stretched such that the core resembles the skin of an onion." pg 174, Glossary "An end of day onionskin has a transparent base glass, usually clear. The marble can have either a colored core, or a transparent, clear core....Generally the base color is white or yellow..." pg 48 Bottom line: since we have no records of names of these marbles from their makers, anyone can name them anything they want. Re: post #1: I kind of think those 4 mibs resemble onionskins so I say they're onionskins. You all can call them whatever you want, but I'd still have to see a pic before I'd bid on anything looking like them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FISHSLAYERMARRBLEGRIFF Posted July 19, 2011 Report Share Posted July 19, 2011 Liver and onions,,,,hold the liver,,,,,,,,,---LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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