Steph

I still think some of the most recent jabo run look uncannily close to furnace swirls. I wouldn't be surprised to see them ending up in wissmach-centric collections someday, unless at 3/4" give or take they're too large to confuse with champs. ?? Greg, I was thinking about a version of your question last night as I continued sorting my Last Dances. As I looked at the really unusual ones, I felt I had been almost "wrong" for having been excited by the most vintage looking ones. As I went back and forth between the more furnace-y ones and the more luminescent, richly hued ones -- especially the purple and lutz combo on the translucent red-orange base -- I couldn't decide whether I'd like to have future runs try to capture a more vintage look or keep playing with unconventional glass types. When the new combos click just right, wow. And when they capture the vintage look, whether in vintage colors or new ... wow. The "wrong" feeling was accompanied by thoughts of John Denver. -- because of an interview he did later in life. He seemed to resent his fans who didn't seem to want to hear his new music. He was a creative person who kept expressing himself in music as he always had but fans mainly wanted to hear songs from the 70's. I was one of the fans who hadn't given his newer music a chance.

Happy Birthday Roger and Jeff!

Cool. Thanks. I wondered if that could possibly be Rosenthal but didn't see how.

Yup. Sue doesn't have dog in this race. She's a handmade collector who's trying to accentuate the positive because she knows how much the Jabos mean to some of us.

And in other news ... Berry Pink didn't become "Berry" until his teens or 20's. The 1900 census listed him as Beney and in 1910 his name was given as Benjaman. So if you want to search for records of his youth, perhaps try out variations on the name Benjamin. (edit: there is a suggestion in one genealogical source that Berry might have been short for "Beryl".) His apparent birthdate changed over the years too. One fairly certain thing is that he was a little older than his obituary indicated -- between 1 and 3 years. Not a big difference but possibly relevant to such things as military service. The 1900 census said he was born April 1898. But the same census said his brother Louis was born May 1896, yet Louis' military records say November. Nov. 10 on one form, Nov. 4 on another. (What's up with that?) Later censuses confuse matters further. The 1910 census implies he was born in 1898 or 1899. The 1920 census implies he was born in 1897, or maybe 1898 if his birthday was in January. The 1930 census implies he was born in 1899 or 1900. Then in 1933 he gave his birthday as Aug. 18, 1900 But by Dec. 1949, he'd lost 2 more years. He was only 47 then. Then in his obituary, he got those two years back. He died in 1962 and was 62. His brother Irwin had name changes also, and also had birthday irregularities. So did their mother. It was as if they were in witness protection and couldn't remember the details of their new identities. As far as employment, in 1920 Berry was a salesman for a silk company and in 1930 he was an executive for a rubber mill. At least that's what the census taker wrote down. And in 1930 it says he was a veteran but I can't make out which 'war or expedition' it says he served in. (edit: it appears to be WW, with a stray line added, and of course, WW is the one he was the right age for.) Will return to marble-related stuff in the next post. :-)

lol Sue. It is funny, isn't it. Pete made a parallel post over at LOM today. Musing about the possibility that machinemade collectors have not only come into their own but been there long enough that they are possibly feeling some of the things handmade collectors about their niches a decade or two ago.

I haven't counted how many there are here now: Whaddaya Know About ... Industrial Uses For Marbles? I still have more to add though. Plus some more background info on some of the uses already there. For example, Edna mentioned putting red marbles in chicken feed to encourage them to eat. I was puzzled by the reference to a specific color but I found out more about that. Something about a bright color to catch the young chickens eyes -- maybe to actually teach them to eat. I need to find where I put the article on that.

I didn't say that, Edna. Nor do I think it. I simply said that Galen didn't hijack the thread by talking about his candidates for best maker. Galen's post was in keeping with the direction the thread had taken at that point. By asking Mike who is favorite maker was, you reinforced the direction Mike had turned it to. And Galen proceeded in the same direction you and Mike took. I know I care about accuracy to the point of being seriously uptight about it. There's a reason though. I've had a lot of turmoil in my life. Being as grounded as I could on as many details as I could was a protection. If even my friends assume things about my thoughts which aren't accurate, that shows how easy it is to make a misstep in chaotic situations. That leads to more confusion. The truth is the only way I know to ground things.

Right. they would have rather had a Peltier or a CAC ... etc. But it's still the same marble. They would have been happy with it if it were a CAC. They're unhappy with it because it is a Jabo. That seems to be more about the name than the intrinsic attributes of the marble itself. Sometimes it would be better if someone said nothing. Some people think I should have said nothing. I didn't see retaliation for disagreement though. Mike uses gentle language and people respond gently, even when they disagree. Galen uses blunt and sometimes confrontational language and the responses are not so gentle. More or less the same message was delivered though by both men. It wasn't the disagreement which caused any "retaliation". It was the manner, with complications due to past history. You took a firm yet relatively lowkey route to begin with, and got a milder response. Then your posts seemed more challenging, and things are escalating now. Freedom of speech doesn't mean freedom from consequences. Freedom of speech doesn't exonerate one of causing pain. If someone feels strongly enough about what they're going to say to risk causing pain, okay, but there it is. Consquences. The one thing I felt in-the-zone certain about when I wrote it was that Galen hadn't hijacked the thread. At least he didn't make the initial detour from the intended topic. It was a bit hard to follow after that. I hurt my friends' feelings by saying that. And they might not forgive me. I felt strongly about it though and I made my choice because I hate it when people think something is unfair but won't say anything because they don't want to rock the boat. All of my friends know the pain of that. There's a famous saying: "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing." Galen doesn't need anything from me, but I needed to defend him on that one point. on principle. You guys have at it. I've taken my stand and my hit. I would rather everyone be honest and factual, but it's so wild in here that I don't think I'll be able to tell anymore what the facts are. *diving into the nearest foxhole* *taking my Charlestons with me*

Don't see why that should anger. There are a few reasons I can think of for the disappointment. Most having nothing to do with the quality or attractions of Jabos. (imho) Often members are hoping to have a marble which people will esteem, for the age, the name or the monetary value. In other words, many simply place more value on non-Jabos, period. It's the same marble before and after the id is made. But the name carries more weight to them than the marble itself. Newbies often love Jabos for their looks. They often have to learn disdain. Similar thing happens with Alleys and CAC's. A "CAC" can lose it's value when it is discovered to be merely a gorgeous Alley. It's the name, not the quality of the marble. An example of a non-superficial reason (imho) is the goal of learning how to i.d. marbles. As long as members can't tell the difference between Jabos and others it means that they haven't reached their goal. that's naturally frustrating. I do like old things myself, and like to know they have history. But that's still something apart from the quality of the marble.

Don't get carried away there Steph but they do look very much like some super busy WV mibs and being those are my favorite types well you already know lol Some of them do! I said so to Randy a coupla weeks ago when he posted this Champ ... and one day I'm going to get the pix to back up my claim. The Jabo Charleston might be where I've noticed it the most. This Charleston which Bob posted is more on the flamey side, but some of mine have lots of little hooks very much like Randy's.

Funny you should say that about flames Winnie. !! I've been planning to start a thread at Jaboland asking people to post their best Jabo flames, maybe including a sort of contest to see who could find a flame with the most points. I have many which are reminiscent of Alleys, and some which to me look like nice, busy Champ furnace swirls. Some are mushy and some have buttcracks, but some are SHARP.

P.s., there are a lot of things about Jabo which are still unknown to most. Isn't that incredible?! Makes me appreciate that we know anything about the old marble companies. Having Jabo still going at all, in any form seems to me to be rescuing history and the wonder of the marble-making ... sort of like how scientists can now rescue some extinct species. Using genetic material from an old specimen and using a new host to give it a rebirth. No, not the same ... but it reminds me of it. Jabo and Dave McCullough are the keepers of what is left of the old companies' DNA, and they've made some new history with it. Pretty exciting to me.

Now as to anyone who thinks the article was about Steve promoting his sales, that's not true. He didn't write the article or know about it before it was posted and he hasn't been listing on ebay in awhile.

Unless some posts were deleted Galen didn't turn it around. Mike expressed a dissenting opinion and Edna expressed an interest in hearing more about it. It's a different thread than it started out as. Galen didn't change the direction though. (unless I missed a deleted post)

That seller has been selling a lot of fantasy boxes, but in an aboveboard manner. I was actually surprised to see that the body of the listing didn't say fantasy. Many of their listings do. Um, I remember one listing awhile back which didn't say "fantasy" in the body. One of the first I noticed from them. At least I think it was this seller. The q&a was very interesting. Someone asking about the condition of the box. The seller saying they didn't describe the box because it wasn't important since it was a fantasy box. Then maybe four more people saying please describe it anyway, why do you think it's fantasy, it sure looks real.

Remember this one? http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=130264764163 Now these: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=220342857183 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=220344234433 I don't go out of my way to look for items connected with that first seller. They just keep popping up.

Yes, old ads are quite fun for that sort of comment, aren't they. The "most healthful sweet". I remember an ad from a later time which advertised sugar content as a benefit for kids -- as in the simple fact that a drink contained sugar. Good after school energy source, or some such thing.

:-) Gary, no one would object. Rhonda, only the worst scan on the page is mine -- the cracker jack akro. (lol) and a few are from ebay. And Paula pointed me to that Visi-pak patent. The better pix I've been posting have been donated for the purpose of furthering knowledge. Maybe someone will take the info here, make some connections, follow some leads, and return with more info. The more we know about, and the more people we have making connections and following leads, the more likely that good information will be found in the future. Like with the California Agates. So little is known about that company. But now more people at least know that it exists. If you find an article on it in an obscure magazine you know there will be interest. If you ever see a museum brochure advertising the "Frank Walker" collection ... maybe you'll look a little closer than you might have otherwise. who knows what might turn up ....

Here is an 1892 Butler Bros catalog ad. It has a lot of information packed into it, some sort of hidden. (click to enlarge) The first time I saw it, I wondered about the Spangles name. Colorful vocabulary is fun to sort out. I posted about that and Dave made a good case for them being onionskins. It was later that I learned this is an historic ad. It is the earliest reference of which I am aware for marbles being packaged for sale in bags. And recently Brian pointed out to me that the clay marbles advertised at the bottom would have been made in Akron. I hadn't thought of the significance of the "made in America" statement before that.

Oscar, you've come a long way baby!

LOL Kryptonite is a great guess but since I don't see a superman, are we supposed to be counting the number of lights? ... Tri-lite?

That's cool. No complaints here. I wouldn't have missed it. You piqued my curiosity though with the little baggie which said "#37 unavailable".

Oh my, how would you know there were any you didn't get? I guess Windy's photos might be a clue! I'm not sure I've found matches to everything she showed! Not sure about the Flamenco yet either. I still have some to sort.