Steph

Here's the best I can do trying to reconcile the Block set and David's original 8. There do seem to be a lot of repeats in Bob's. maybe?

Here's a bigger copy of the pic Al posted. I noticed that about no Pink Champagne in Block's photo. Had fun trying to count how many distinct family members this would add up to when taken together with this pic you showed of the original 8 in your article. The one on the middle right of the Block photo doesn't look particularly green to me. But Carole has one which came across as very green in her pix (below). Carole knows hers is not from the original 8. However, it is a Pelt and was said to be part of the later runs of the larger Nova family, in the broad sense of the term. If I understand correctly.

not too shabby

Post Classics! Well, there have been a whole lot more threads on this. Time to start gathering them up! In the meantime, check out Jaboland! http://anythinggoes43567.yuku.com/ Okay, starting to gather now. Any recommendations? This is going to be be slow if it's just me doing the searching. October 2008: Jabo Tributes January 2009: Joe Hogue Box June 2010: What A Tribute 1" Run Pictures!

Gary, that's neat about the drain. I'm afraid I'd bust the massager. (don't ask) DC, I remember that article. That would be Issue #17, Dec. 2006. I think we've managed to squeak some new uses in. Not bragging -- just saying I've been surprised once or twice. I don't remember us mentioning hydroponics though. And it looks like there are a couple of other variations we sorta have here but not quite the same application he gives. cool. p.s., did we have throwing marbles on the ground to make pursuers slip? I have articles where that was done but not sure if it made it here. That's another one Mike mentions.

Pretty pretty pretty! (so sad about the screech.) Here's the most grown-up pic I could find of my bestest boys. They're fatter than this now. (another gratuitous web pic ;-)

I'm a little stressed out by talk of machines. even tho' I started it ! I found these fluffy things in the folder where I was looking for images of people working at their grinding machines. I felt instantly better. *happy sigh*

Here's a passage from later in that article: An earlier article, from July 27, 1924, was printed while the new factory was being built. It said they expected to employ about 15 people. That article said they manufactured "marbles, beads and various agate and onyx novelties." While I'm thinking of it, a Dec. 27, 1925 article says they added more machines and had to double their number of employees but it didn't say how many they had. In 1925, their line was given as marbles, radiator caps and gear shift balls. So matching the 1924 figures up for an estimate -- 6000 marbles with 15 employees -- that would be an average of 400 marbles per day per employee, plus the other novelties. I guess the process was more mechanized that I had originally pictured.

Here's some info about the author! http://www.akronmarbles.com/marble_industry_history.htm

Fantastic. I love the referenced to "sulphide figures". It's like a missing link for how "figure" marbles came to be known as "sulphides".

LOL some more. I didn't see that you had quoted Mike R. and were asking about the small marbles he is showing. I didn't even see Mike R. had posted. Sorry Mike R, I gotta go with Mike B on these. He knows whereof he speaks.

LOL. Sorry. I realize I didn't answer your question. I just got snagged on the technicality of you saying 1" and Mike B. saying 7/8". I'll let someone else address how the plus or minus would have been accomplished.

Well Mike said it was a 7/8" machine. The 1" would be at the top of its range. P.s. Mike B. has very good sources! Main thing is that just the one size of machine was involved. So the 7/8" give or take was the size of the run. And 11/16" would have been too much "take".

for example: http://books.google.com/books?id=VPUQAAAAI...enturine+copper Hmmm ... I should read this article. Haven't yet. Just pulled it up with a quick search on copper and aventurine, because that was faster than finding the other chemistry book where I read about it. In my quick skim of this article it sounds as if the glass was named aventurine well before the 1800's and the copper in it was discovered/rediscovered in the early 1800's. Skimming to the end, I see a "blue green" color associated with copper-based glass, contrasted to a yellow green shade of iron-based glass. Here's another one. http://books.google.com/books?id=tckoAAAAY...urine#PPA265,M1 This one mentions mica in the stone version and the copper in the glass version. It appears to be talking about a brownish version of the glass. Green aventurine glaze is mentioned after that though that seems to be talking about different minerals -- chromium? Fun stuff -- please note, I am a mathematician reading chemistry texts and am not pretending to understand it all. Just enough to know that copper is associated with what has been called aventurine glass of various shades. When the stone was discovered it was named AFTER the glass. At least that is the story I learned some time ago.

I do respect your knowledge. However, I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that in the 1800's aventurine was used to denote a sparkley copper-based glass. Chemists wrote about it.

The eagle and tribute (last dance) runs were the first where I ever heard green mica glass called aventurine. Clarification had to be made about how the term was being used because in fact usually aventurine refers to copper-based glass. At least this is usual in the contexts I have studied. Sounds like in your discipline -- would that be contemporary glass artistry? -- the definitions might be different. I can accept that. However, in some disciplines aventurine and goldstone are very very closely related, even synonymous. Perhaps it is mica which makes my green aventurine stone look different from green aventurine glass. I need to look into that. I think I know where I have stored my aventurine mineral sample.

Thank you Ray. And it's just too GREAT. The "club" of children and grandchildren of the company founders is very exclusive. It's awesome that they're so willing to talk to us. Sue ... I don't know! Doug has all those mibs so maybe he could tell, but I'm still just learning how to recognize facets myself so if he doesn't already know how to find them I don't know if I could explain it well. But I think, yes, they would have to be faceted ... wouldn't they? Look at that belt in the picture of "R. W. Walker". Can you imagine it? Standing there, holding the stone up to the belt for a bit, maybe rocking it back a forth a little, and then rotating your grip, and holding the marble against the belt some more. When were the machines invented which could grind them without facets? I don't know. Joe ... basically the fella who donated the pix of R. W. Walker and the California Agate boxes ... he made me WANT to do it. That's about it. I went in circles on Google. I went in circles at Newspaperarchive.com. I went in circles at Google Books. And then I thought I'd go in the same circles in the Google News archive, but what the heck, I gave it a try and got a break -- found the LA Times story. :-) Thanks everyone. It's been so fun. And I know Doug and Mia will appreciate your remarks. (They have the link!)

Yep, he sure says it. p. 114 of the 4th edition of Marbles: Identification and Price Guide. Well, I'll definitely take David's accounts over Block's. Do you really think that none over 7/8" had been found when he wrote that? I don't. I think he just got it wrong. An 11/16" mib which dropped out of a 1" machine? I received a few boxes of unsorted Jabos in the roughly 3/4" size. A very small number of them were almost as small as 5/8", but all of those had issues. The difference between 11/16" and 15/16" ... it's hard to see how something that small run on an inch machine would come out with good shape. I'm afraid that I do think there is a way to mistake an 11/16" mib for a Rootbeer float. How close to you think that 11/16" mib I posted above looks. I can see how someone might mistake it for a rootbeer float. I don't think it is though. I think it is more likely to be related to those "moldy mibs" or "shield mibs" that some have posted before.

Loved the bowling ball! really makes ya think if it doesn't hit you right on the head -- lol

Goldstone and aventurine are sometimes used synonymously. The mineral version of aventurine -- not sure which color(s) -- is a rare case of a stone which was named after the synthetic version it resembled. I have a piece of green aventurine stone. It doesn't look all that much like green glass aventurine, and doesn't look at all like red goldstone. There's lots of cool info about aventurine and/or goldstone floating around. Like oxblood, this is a category where the name might be used widely and in different disciplines, but potentially with significant differences in each discipline. Might be considered "common knowledge" in each discipline even though it's foreign to people outside the discipline. p.s. I've had some cool "goldstone" buttons which had golden flakes in black glass. Czech.

Alan's present 1" example. (He might have the date of production wrong, but the date has generally been unclear anyway.) an 11/16" one someone is currently selling and calling a pelt rootbeer float:

I've seen some different sizes given for them. I am pretty sure I have seen one offered which was over an inch. And it was by someone credible. Alan or Block. Both make some mistakes, but I guess I trust them on rootbeer floats or others made at Peltier that day. 11/16" is smaller than anything I've seen or any story I've heard though. 11/16" are pretty firmly ruled out whenever anyone asks about them. And they do come up relatively often. There are some possibly-foreign master-like banana-y mibs which tend to be about that size. They get a "no" verdict as Rootbeer Floats. edit: Block's BOOK says 11/16"? ?? I say "nova family" because it is natural to think of the marbles made with the novas on that day as related. It is my compromise between the purists and those who are inclined to call the whole run "novas". I understand that only one of the marbles in the run was a nova. What I still don't understand is about the other marbles besides the original 8 which are reported by credible people to be part of the extended family. Made on a later date, I gather. Wow, Galen just posted an awesome pair of pix at LOM: Rootbeer Floats. They are described as 1". They were made in 9/13/88 -- BEFORE THE NOVA RUN. edit: no they are not described as 1". They are described as an experiment for a 1" Rainbow. (Rainbow? that's what it looks like -- but looks like someone may have tried to rub the last letter out) While I'm linkin', here's David's article at MM: Root Beer Floats, Novas, and Pink Champagnes, Peltier Marble Company Here's my index to most of David's articles at MM: index. Since he's actively posting now, there are some new threads which will need to be added, such as current cat's eye threads. But those are still being added to in the main forum.

I wrote to the Los Angeles Times reprint office to try to get permission to share this whole article from 1924. First of all I wanted to simply find out if it was still under copyright, and then I asked how to go about getting permission to share in case it was. I got an answer which wasn't an answer, and then didn't hear back when I asked for clarification. So I shall share part and hope that this falls within the Fair Use provision of the copyright law. I tried to paraphrase it earlier but that was nowhere near as good as the real thing. So, that's some history of one American marble maker. The story was in part to announce the move the company had made from the rented shed where they first set up shop to a new building made specially for their growing business. Mexican (lower California) onxy was very popular in the 1920's for many items, for children and adults. And that was an exciting find. To remind you, here are some of the images we've seen before. The search started with an awesome picture of a man who may or may not be R. W. Walker. We don't know who he is. We do know he is not the father of "Frankie" because Frankie was Frank Doig Mitchell, the son of George Douglas Mitchell. The 2nd pic is Frankie at 12 or so, as he appeared in Popular Science. Then boxes the company sold. And a 1931 ad from George Sourlis. (click links below thumbnails for larger images) http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o151/modularforms/Stone/CaliforniaAgatesFactory_b.jpg http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o151/modularforms/Stone/1932_04_PopularScience_FrankieMitch.jpg http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o151/modularforms/Stone/CaliforniaAgates002b.jpg http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o151/modularforms/Stone/25OnyxMarbles_010b.jpg http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o151/modularforms/History/1931TRACY_WELLS_No117_p224_GSourlis.jpg But the best "find" was still to come! You know me. As much as we had learned it seemed like we were only in the middle of the story. I couldn't stop there! So I did a "bit" more searching on the net and ... I found Frank's children, Mia and Doug, thanks to a poem Mia wrote about her dad. It has been fantastic. They are so nice. And so proud of their father and grandfather. We 'chatted' a bit. It was awesome. One technical point they told me is something I suspected was true -- at some point the company name changed from the "California Agate Co." to the "California Onyx Co.". Among other things, I also learned that Frankie grew up to work on the Apollo spacecraft. How cool is that? And here .... I really need a drum roll. This is just sooooo wowww... Some of the family treasures, photos courtesy of Doug Mitchell. A couple of hundred California Agate marbles, practically factory fresh. Some of the other things the company made -- gear shift knobs, the base of a pen holder set, and a decorative piece of polished onyx with one edge left rough. And the real father of Frank, George Douglas Mitchell, the fighting Irishman who settled his family in Los Angeles after WWI and started making aggies. Note there are two different styles of gear shift knobs there. One is thicker than the other. Some have the metal inset with the name Calif. Onyx. Others don't. One thing which is still not clear is what their radiator caps looked like. (click links below thumbnails) http://i588.photobucket.com/albums/ss324/CalifOnyx/Marbles001_70pct.jpg http://i588.photobucket.com/albums/ss324/CalifOnyx/Marbles004_cropped.jpg http://i588.photobucket.com/albums/ss324/CalifOnyx/Marbles005_50pct.jpg http://i588.photobucket.com/albums/ss324/CalifOnyx/Marbles012_50pct.jpg http://i588.photobucket.com/albums/ss324/CalifOnyx/Marbles014_50pct.jpg http://i588.photobucket.com/albums/ss324/CalifOnyx/Marbles021_50pct.jpg http://i588.photobucket.com/albums/ss324/CalifOnyx/Marbles008_50pct.jpg http://i588.photobucket.com/albums/ss324/CalifOnyx/Marbles016_50pct.jpg

The person with the 0 feedback has revealed enough information about himself so that I can tell it is someone who has been reported to ebay many times as a problem buyer. More than one of his ebay IDs have been cancelled. He is a real collector but .... well, he brags a lot and not all of his claims are well-founded. He bids a lot but doesn't always pay for what he committed to buy. And as a seller, he has listed at least one really neat item, and then pulled it down, and then relisted it but it wasn't quite as neat the last time I saw him list it. (thinking of a pelt jobber box -- let me see if I can find that link where Art solved the mystery for me) (here's that link) Every seller has to start somewhere, and I sure don't envy this guinea seller having to start out in the current ebay environment where he is vulnerable to buyers for whom we cannot leave feedback. Now, here's where I'm going to give everyone something to razz me about ;-) -- the subject of faux guineas vs. real. I'm not sure as many are fake as people say. I don't give the 0-feedback bidder credit for owning a 15/16" guinea. Ohmigosh, I sure don't. He has bragged about how much he as paid for glass items which I'm pretty sure were modern but he thought were old. But I also am not sure that some people haven't interfered with legit guinea sales by talking about how no real guinea would have bubbles or some particular pattern. How can they be so sure no guinea could look like that? Not saying whether I think this guys mibs are real or not. I see why people would not think so and I would love to see clearer pix. But in the past I've thought some mibs had more potential to be real than they were being given credit for. Scott Patrick can apparently make guineas real enough to fool people like me (LOL) but I'm just not so sure that some people aren't a little too quick to write off some possible guineas. I really do feel for the challenges of collectors who have invested in marbles for years but who are now turning around and selling for the first time in today's market. Confident in their knowledge and knowing how much they've invested, but possibly facing for the first time this army of internet collectors with some pretty aggressive behavior and all our "common knowledge" based on reading the same sort of threads over and over on the boards. Rightly or wrongly, I'm feeling real sympathy for this seller. The advice he got to send them to Marblealan is very very good.

The colors look very close to snowflake obsidian. But a reversed pattern from what I'm used to seeing. (used to white splotches on black. This is more like black splotches in white.)