AKRO Left-hand Twist Corks

[I'llhavethat1]

Don't recall thinking about it before, but interesting topic...

[schmoozer]

Would love to find some old footage of the process they used. I’m sure there are a bunch of old 8mm spools laying around in someone’s attic?

[Dave 13]

hi this vid by Stephen Bahr shows a machine at work and lots of other cool old glass making 

 

[schmoozer]

2 hours ago, Dave 13 said:

hi this vid by Stephen Bahr shows a machine at work and lots of other cool old glass making 

 

I saw part of this regarding Blenko.

[Steph]

14 hours ago, wvrons said:

I agree with all and with the use of two sets of rolls or four rolls. Probably two running side by side to the left of the furnace and two running side by side to the right of the furnace. This equipment took up a lot of space at the end of the furnace. I see the shears were air operated and tripped by the gather person. That would be slow with all the corks made. I am not sure the corkscrews were hand gathered. I wonder if the shear was changed or a different type shear was used once they were making corks ? At some point I am sure they changed to a more automatic shear. The picture above is a 1915 Miller shear. When were the first Akro corkscrew marbles produced ? I forget the patent date for the spinner cup equipment ?  

 

 

Corks were introduced for sale in the 1930 season. 

 

The Akro Spinner cup patent was filed in August 1928.

 

[Steph]

Here's our standard image of the patent, where someone added the color illustrations.  (I don't know who.)

[schmoozer]

10 hours ago, Steph said:

Here's our standard image of the patent, where someone added the color illustrations.  (I don't know who.)

Do you have anything on the “double” feed system the might produce both left and right twist mibs?

[cheese]

You know how so many Akro corks are what we call "messed up corks"? I assumed that the spinner cup was gear driven, a simple mechanism with a round pinion gear on the spinner cup shaft with a long bar with teeth on it that pushed out one way, then pulled in, then pushed out, spinning the cup both ways, like the long rods that connect one wheel to another on a steam locomotive, back and forth as the wheel goes round. If that was the case, the spinner cup would spin one direction, then reverse to the other direction an equal amount of time. A "messed up" cork would be one that hit the cup as it changed direction. Just my theory and the way I had it pictured in my mind.

[schmoozer]

1 minute ago, cheese said:

You know how so many Akro corks are what we call "messed up corks"? I assumed that the spinner cup was gear driven, a simple mechanism with a round pinion gear on the spinner cup shaft with a long bar with teeth on it that pushed out one way, then pulled in, then pushed out, spinning the cup both ways, like the long rods that connect one wheel to another on a steam locomotive, back and forth as the wheel goes round. If that was the case, the spinner cup would spin one direction, then reverse to the other direction an equal amount of time. A "messed up" cork would be one that hit the cup as it changed direction. Just my theory and the way I had it pictured in my mind.

Now that makes a lot of sense!!!

[cheese]

I think I saw that drawing wrong. The spinner cup is sitting on the gear, not on the end of that angled rod coming up from the lower right. I was thinking that was what was driving the cup one way or the other but maybe not? If not, then what I had envisioned is probably not possible.

 

But still, I think the cup went one way, then reversed, and back and forth all day in order for there to be an equal amount of left and right twists plus ones that are messed up. I came to that conclusion years ago when I found a corkscrew that switched direction dead center and went from right twist to left halfway through the marble. Could be wrong.

[schmoozer]

10 minutes ago, cheese said:

I think I saw that drawing wrong. The spinner cup is sitting on the gear, not on the end of that angled rod coming up from the lower right. I was thinking that was what was driving the cup one way or the other but maybe not? If not, then what I had envisioned is probably not possible.

 

But still, I think the cup went one way, then reversed, and back and forth all day in order for there to be an equal amount of left and right twists plus ones that are messed up. I came to that conclusion years ago when I found a corkscrew that switched direction dead center and went from right twist to left halfway through the marble. Could be wrong.

Do you have a pic?

I had a large slag “chevron” that exhibited that exact condition, it now is in Dani and Ernie’s collection. Swapped it for a Winchester knife…🤔

not sure if I have a pic of it or not, been a few years.

[cheese]

I don't have a pic on file. I'm not sure where the marble is but I'm sure I have it. Super busy right now but I'll try to dig it out in the next few days.

[schmoozer]

Managed to find a 19/32” purple “chevron” with reversed poles. Someone told me Peltier years ago, forgot who it was.

[Shamrock Marbles]

22 hours ago, cheese said:

I think I saw that drawing wrong. The spinner cup is sitting on the gear, not on the end of that angled rod coming up from the lower right. I was thinking that was what was driving the cup one way or the other but maybe not? If not, then what I had envisioned is probably not possible.

 

But still, I think the cup went one way, then reversed, and back and forth all day in order for there to be an equal amount of left and right twists plus ones that are messed up. I came to that conclusion years ago when I found a corkscrew that switched direction dead center and went from right twist to left halfway through the marble. Could be wrong.

The patent describes a mechanism that was used to alter the rotational velocity of the spinning cup, plus how it could be adjusted to reverse directions.  If you synchronized the dwell between reversing directions with the shearing mechanism, you would get a cork in one direction. then the next cork would be the other direction.  If you sychronized the reversal between each shearing action, then you would get a chevron (rams head) decoration. -John

[schmoozer]

Managed to find a 19/32” purple “chevron” with reversed poles. Someone told me Peltier years ago, forgot who it was.

[schmoozer]

So, if the twist alternated, would you expect a 50/50 split in the 100 count boxes for each color combo?

has anyone looked at this in original boxes?

[akroorka]

It is a good question schmoozer but it is just not quite the way that it worked.

Marbles of all makers were stockpiled, then marketed or packed for marketing.

Boxing, bagging, and mass sales were conducted much later in the whole process. To expect a 50-50 mix of left vs right corkscrews in a box of 10, 20 or 100, or a mass sale of 2,000,000 would not be anything to expect, they were all mixed together. They were no doubt sorted by color/style but not sorted otherwise.

I would expect a line of ten similar/same corkscrews to have at least some that opposed each other but 50-50 would be a stretch.

Marble-On!!!

[schmoozer]

22 minutes ago, akroorka said:

It is a good question schmoozer but it is just not quite the way that it worked.

Marbles of all makers were stockpiled, then marketed or packed for marketing.

Boxing, bagging, and mass sales were conducted much later in the whole process. To expect a 50-50 mix of left vs right corkscrews in a box of 10, 20 or 100, or a mass sale of 2,000,000 would not be anything to expect, they were all mixed together. They were no doubt sorted by color/style but not sorted otherwise.

I would expect a line of ten similar/same corkscrews to have at least some that opposed each other but 50-50 would be a stretch.

Marble-On!!!

Agreed, what have you found in your boxes? I only have AKRO game marbles boxes…🤣

[cheese]

Thank you for that drawing and technical description John, it was driven like a snowblower! I didn't know that drawing existed, now I don't have to imagine how it must have been driven. Unfortunately now I have no idea how half seem to be right and half left again other than the two operating opposing each other theory mentioned above. Any drawings or technical data recorded in that regard?

[Shamrock Marbles]

11 hours ago, cheese said:

Thank you for that drawing and technical description John, it was driven like a snowblower! I didn't know that drawing existed, now I don't have to imagine how it must have been driven. Unfortunately now I have no idea how half seem to be right and half left again other than the two operating opposing each other theory mentioned above. Any drawings or technical data recorded in that regard?

Down the "Rabbit Hole"...

A few things to consider:

1) Not all ideas and inventions are submitted for a patent.

2) Not all patent applications that are submitted are ultimately granted protection.

3) A patent can undergo numerous changes between the initial application to being finally granted protection.

4) The patent you see has the minimum information needed to convince an examiner and enough to defend the idea.  (Notice there are no dimensions, references to speeds, etc.)

5) The patent doesn't restrict the assignee or the end user from future improvements.

6) Not all subsequent improvements are re-applied for protection.

7)  Not all subsequent improvements that are applied for protection are granted by the US Patent and Trademark Office.

***

US Patent 1,828,216 patent application date was 08/29/1928.  The patent was awarded on 10/20/1931 with an expiration date of 10/20/1948.

So, it took 3-years for the patent to be processed before being awarded.  It would be very interesting to see the correspondence between the Hartford-Empire Corporation and the USPTO.

Additionally, how the machine was actually running may have been significantly different than when the patent was granted!!

***

The concept of patent 1,828,216 was to provide a regular sized gob of glass that has defined streaks of color to imitate natural rock (think "agate").

"To this end, it is desirable that the streaks or striations of glass of a secondary color, or secondary colors, shall be clearly distinct visually from the glass of the base color and that the lines of demarcation between the glass of the base color and glass of a secondary color, or secondary colors, shall extend more or less irregularly for substantial distances close to or at the surface of the article to be formed, thus causing the finished article to closely resemble the natural rock that is to be imitated."

So, the concept of the spinning cup was to twist the column of glass hanging from the nozzle.  They designed and built a mechanism that could: 1) Run at a constant velocity in one direction, 2) Run at a variable velocity in one direction, and  3) Run at a variable velocity with a reverse in direction.

***

Along with this spinning cup mechanism, there was a mechanism that varied the flow of secondary glass to provide uneven thicknesses of the streaks.

I want you to look at and think about the surface decorations on Akro Oxblood Lemonade, Akro Silver Oxblood marbles and Akro Oxblood Egg Yolk marbles.

These are early (no pun intended) marbles and they are NOT consistent "corks" like "Snakes", "Tightlines" or later Akro "Corks".

You can see in some samples how the stream reverses direction as you follow the color from pole-to-pole.

But you can also see how the color decorations change in width (say from thick-to-thin and back again).

***

The design shown in patent 1,828,216 has some weaknesses that probably became apparent right at the start and after continued use.

To me, the dual friction wheels are truly an Achilles' heel in this mechanism.

This device is prone to wear and would stop driving consistently.

If the spinning cup quits "turning", you start to get "patches".

***

There is another later patent that addresses this mechanism with a "better" drive system.

It is this newer patent that I believe was used to make true corks.

John

Shamrock Marbles

 

[schmoozer]

34 minutes ago, Shamrock Marbles said:

Down the "Rabbit Hole"...

A few things to consider:

1) Not all ideas and inventions are submitted for a patent.

2) Not all patent applications that are submitted are ultimately granted protection.

3) A patent can undergo numerous changes between the initial application to being finally granted protection.

4) The patent you see has the minimum information needed to convince an examiner and enough to defend the idea.  (Notice there are no dimensions, references to speeds, etc.)

5) The patent doesn't restrict the assignee or the end user from future improvements.

6) Not all subsequent improvements are re-applied for protection.

7)  Not all subsequent improvements that are applied for protection are granted by the US Patent and Trademark Office.

***

US Patent 1,828,216 patent application date was 08/29/1928.  The patent was awarded on 10/20/1931 with an expiration date of 10/20/1948.

So, it took 3-years for the patent to be processed before being awarded.  It would be very interesting to see the correspondence between the Hartford-Empire Corporation and the USPTO.

Additionally, how the machine was actually running may have been significantly different than when the patent was granted!!

***

The concept of patent 1,828,216 was to provide a regular sized gob of glass that has defined streaks of color to imitate natural rock (think "agate").

"To this end, it is desirable that the streaks or striations of glass of a secondary color, or secondary colors, shall be clearly distinct visually from the glass of the base color and that the lines of demarcation between the glass of the base color and glass of a secondary color, or secondary colors, shall extend more or less irregularly for substantial distances close to or at the surface of the article to be formed, thus causing the finished article to closely resemble the natural rock that is to be imitated."

So, the concept of the spinning cup was to twist the column of glass hanging from the nozzle.  They designed and built a mechanism that could: 1) Run at a constant velocity in one direction, 2) Run at a variable velocity in one direction, and  3) Run at a variable velocity with a reverse in direction.

***

Along with this spinning cup mechanism, there was a mechanism that varied the flow of secondary glass to provide uneven thicknesses of the streaks.

I want you to look at and think about the surface decorations on Akro Oxblood Lemonade, Akro Silver Oxblood marbles and Akro Oxblood Egg Yolk marbles.

These are early (no pun intended) marbles and they are NOT consistent "corks" like "Snakes", "Tightlines" or later Akro "Corks".

You can see in some samples how the stream reverses direction as you follow the color from pole-to-pole.

But you can also see how the color decorations change in width (say from thick-to-thin and back again).

***

The design shown in patent 1,828,216 has some weaknesses that probably became apparent right at the start and after continued use.

To me, the dual friction wheels are truly an Achilles' heel in this mechanism.

This device is prone to wear and would stop driving consistently.

If the spinning cup quits "turning", you start to get "patches".

***

There is another later patent that addresses this mechanism with a "better" drive system.

It is this newer patent that I believe was used to make true corks.

John

Shamrock Marbles

 

Excellent info, thank you!!

how did this timing fit into the freese adaptation? Few corks have “eyelashes”, correct?

also, while we are down here… what was the production timeframe for slags, and was it affected by the start of corkscrews? I imagine them being made on different machines(kilns).

[akroorka]

Great info for sure. My head is spinning⚙️.

There had to be much larger "spinner cups" used in the production of "Akroware" I have seen no discussion on the topic anywhere but the way that much of the akroware looks it must have been a thing, just on a much larger scale and slower of course.

I have always believed that "eyelashes" were a result of worn shears or cutoff knives. There are many corkscrews with eyelashes and I supposed they--the eyelashes disappeared after some refinements in the cutoff process. I have watched some Chinese production videos where the shears look like they will never dull.

Long runs were made of corkscrews and shutdown to replace the shears meant time and production lost along with money spent. Good thing for us--I love a good eyelash on an Akro.

Great discussion.

Marble--On!!

[akroorka]

16 hours ago, schmoozer said:

Agreed, what have you found in your boxes? I only have AKRO game marbles boxes…🤣

I am a bottom feeder when it comes to boxes. I have never purchased a complete factory filled box.

Most that I own are at least 70% backfilled or more--just the way that I can afford to collect---spread out the dollars. Research on just how to backfill boxes keeps me entertained. I will check just for kicks.

Marble--On!!

[Shamrock Marbles]

2 hours ago, schmoozer said:

Excellent info, thank you!!

how did this timing fit into the freese adaptation? Few corks have “eyelashes”, correct?

also, while we are down here… what was the production timeframe for slags, and was it affected by the start of corkscrews? I imagine them being made on different machines(kilns).

Ahh, the Freese and Eyelash discussion! As Akroorka has so stated, the eyelash marks are the result of dulled/scarred shear-knives.  The clearance between the opposing knives comes into play.  May I also add that glass and environment temperature are also a factor (another discussion?).

Slags were very early.  There is a post on this site that discusses Akro Slags.  In fact, it had an excerpt from a trade publication describing how these marbles were made.  In a nutshell, they were hand-gathered out of a pot and hand delivered to a pneumatic shearing mechanism made by Miller.

John

Shamrock Marbles

[Shamrock Marbles]

Here is the other ensuing patent (US1828229):

There are a few things to note here:

1) Gone is the "reversing" cup claim as stated in the prior art.

2) The mechanism is much simpler and less prone to drive failure.

3) Spinning Cup speed is constant, unidirectional and not dynamically changing during operation.

4) The Pitch Diameters of the Pulleys (Item 12) are adjustable and can deliver a range of rotational speeds.

5) The "Inventor" is no other than Gilbert C. Marsh.  The President of the Gilbert-Marsh Shoe Store!!

6) The marble machine silhouette is the machine used at Akro.

-John

Shamrock Marbles