Royal3

I’m no great expert on Joseph’s coats, frankly I’ll take onions over them any day, but I do think there’s a distinct difference so I went back to the reference books to see if I could define them a bit better. Onionskins got their name from their resemblance to onions, obviously, and so they have layers of color; a base color of some sort with other pigments layered on top, then encased in clear. A Joseph’s has, quoting Block, “a subsurface layer of glass that is composed of different colored strands, placed very closely together.” Others have said the bands should run from pole to pole; they may be shrunken on the sides (like some onions,) and they may be open or closed (some onions are open as well, like errors or maybe with mica or other panels.) Generally they are five or more colors, but that’s not hard and fast. The second marble you posted Dindo I’d call a slightly shrunken paneled onion - almost an Indian onion - it’s got that odd green base with one red and one blue panel. It’s a bit of an oddball, as panels are usually symmetrical, 2&2, e.g. and that sea foam green is interesting. How big is it? I think Roger’s theory about how the Joseph’s coat evolved is well worth reading below (though I disagree with his comment about Joseph’s being “a larger class.”) Nearly every Joseph’s coat I have ever seen in 20 years does have a rough or later pontil, not a ground (earlier) one, and “English” or brighter colors. If you see an obvious Joseph’s with a faceted pontil, I’d look at it really, really hard. There are always the rare ones; Morphy’s has this “rule breaker” coat up on their next auction: http://auctions.morphyauctions.com/mobile/lotdetail.aspx?inventoryid=447958&seo=striking_joseph_s_coat_marble_ “My understanding is that early on in the history of marble production, the onionskin required a base layer of white and/or yellow beacuse they were the only common opque colors of glass. Then different kinds of transparent surface coloration was used, sometimes full stripes, but more often pieces of broken rods, that stretched out to make a variety of surface shapes, jagged or blobby. Once more opaque colors became available ("English", bright colors), there was no purpose for the base coat any longer, and for the most part, joseph coat (at least ones with no base) replaced the onionskin. How often do you see an onionskin made with the bright, "English" opaque colors? Then a great number of variations appeared, including the use of open panels, and various strange core structures. Sometimes they take on an appearance of a latticinio, a solid core, or a banded clear, but they are all really a product of the shift to bright opaque surace banding colors (attached a pic below of a group of these that I was lucky enough to find as a partial solitaire set). I feel this was a major change in the nature of this type of marble, deserving of some names that reflect the change. Though I know it was not the original intended use, the term "joseph coat" seems to have evloved to designate this larger class of handmade.” Dindo I hope that helps.

Steph I’d put this one in the “coat closet.” I’m an onion fan myself, but I tracked down this definition of both on the MC site from 2007 that might help: http://marbleconnection.com/topic/7680-josephs-coat-vs-onionskin/ “Onionskins have a base layer of colored glass, usually white, or yellow, or panelled white and yellow. On top of that base layer, various stripes of (usually transparent) color are added. A joseph coat has the stripes of color, but there is no base, and most often the stripes are opaque.”

Probably Akro with that pattern, I inherited a couple pretty similar to it.

It’s a beauty in hand, too. I bought it from the late, great Alan Basinet some years ago and I was thrilled to get it. He knew his marbles...what a loss when left us.

Ron you are a marvel, a walking encyclopedia of marble knowledge! That really helps bring home the relationship between air, good furnace management, and seedy glass. I tend to like such glass in some marbles - in old Germans and the odd machinemade it can add eye appeal - but it does carry a risk.

I’m so saddened to hear that news. Like Alan (nicely done Alan) I met Mike at a show in Ohio nearly 20 years ago as he was introducing a lot of us to the wonderful world of JABO. He put a lot of time and creativity into those sets - he really knew how to market the product. Mike was a lot of fun at the shows, too, I miss those days. Rest in peace Mike.

Bottom left. S.W.A.G.

What a beauty - an unusual one. All of these are top-notch examples!

What a find.

I've sold most of my big MFC slags, but I have one that's over an inch - here's a group that shows a range of sizes to give you an idea, Dindo. The fancy Bennington is 1-5/16", the brown slag is 1-3/16, the blue - which I think is Akro - is 1", the aqua is just under 7/8", the orange is 3/4", and the electric yellow CAC is 5/8".

I think you’re right, folks, it looks more German to me, too.

Yes, Akro did make Popeye shooters, 3/4” or so. They’re not common or ridiculously HTF, and are of course pricier than the 5/8” ones if buying. I had a set of five with three colors, red/yellow/green on a fluorescent base, that illustrated the spinner cup either slowing down or speeding up as the cork patterns got progressively weaker until the last was a Popeye patch. Unfortunately I sold the set or I’d post it

I finally found those two "chunky" Master Sunbursts pics...

Probably my favorite combo...the first Akro shown is on a transparent blue base with white threading corking in it. It was in my dad's Akro 200 tin in the attic that got me into marble collecting. Unfortunately it had been "well loved," and I had no idea how hard it would be to find a mint one just like it.

Wow - so is that Matthews Super Jetson, Alan! Impeccable.

It looked fine here Lind, no worries - and what a nice photo it is, too, with that big chunk of debris in there. It seems like Masters had “chunkier” marbles than anyone else, maybe because of their furnace, maybe because their styles allowed you to see them?

I realized after browsing through here I never posted my mug shot and properly introduced myself - oops, sorry folks, better late than never I guess. I’m an old retired married guy in the NE Columbus, Ohio area, and I’ve been marble collecting for almost 20 years (well, almost 60 if you count my childhood Crisco can of cats, clearies, Marble Kings and Masters.) My favorites are unusual “see-thrus,” especially HTF Akro snakes, ribbons and Popeyes, the hand gathered faceted pontil slags fka Leightons, and smaller (1” or so) cloud onions. But if it’s round and pretty...

If MFC went to size 10 that would equate to 1-1/4” (6=1”, 7=1-1/1/16”, 8=1-1/18”, etc.) They definitely made slags those sizes and larger, at least up to 1-5/8” (size 16, my grandson’s shoe size lol,) though slag experts like greg11 would know what the largest one made was I’m sure. I wonder if the 11-16s all had to special ordered?

Vance I’m sorry but I can’t seem to focus on your picture - it’s a bit too close. I will say most inclusions in marbles are pieces of unmelted sand or chunks of fire brick from older furnaces. I look for such things because I like oddities - I’ll try to post a couple of pics later.

Very cool! I would think that the glass had to be well annealed to take the thermal shock, and I wonder how they secured the one pictured to that metal plate because it took a pretty good blow on landing, enough to buckle the plate. A 28 oz. marble is pretty hefty, too - 3” range?

That seems logical, doesn’t it? I wonder if anyone had had success digging at old schoolyards in and around Illinois?

Put your UV light on that yellowish Akro slag near the center bottom of the second photo and it’ll light up nicely.

If you can get to one of the Ohio marble shows each year, Michelle, you'll learn a lot quickly. You can get good examples in hand, have more experienced collectors around to help, and you will be amazed at how much your knowledge of the hobby will grow in a day or two. Bonus - you'll have a blast! Oh, and you'll probably buy a few marbles, too..