migbar Posted June 20, 2011 Report Share Posted June 20, 2011 Does anyone here know for certain what the Peltier Prima Agate marbles were, vintage 1925-1928 ? How about the Peltier Glassonix marbles, early 1930's ? thanks a bunch, mike b. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lstmmrbls Posted June 20, 2011 Report Share Posted June 20, 2011 I know for a fact the so called Honey Onyx type came in a box marked Prima Agates. I believe it may have been a term for a variety of marbles through a timeline? Or maybe a general term. What does it appear to be on the paperwork? One type? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
migbar Posted June 20, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 20, 2011 Most of the Prima Agate boxes I have seen have honey onyx, or rainbos, or bloodies or something that look to be from a later time period. I think they should be a hand gathered type. Gino Biffany told me once that he thought they were predominately red swirls with a translucent grey and white marbleized body. He didn't seem too sure, he had no pictures, and he seemed curious, also. All I know from the paperwork is that they were very difficult and expensive to make, and they made very few of them compared to their regular onyx marbles, and even compared to the cerise onyx, which were half the price of the Primas. However, they did have a lot of prima agate boxes made up in the mid-20's, and they likely used those boxes until 1931. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBlock Posted June 20, 2011 Report Share Posted June 20, 2011 There were a lot of empties floating around about 20 years ago. You used to be able to pick up 4 square ones nested in a larger rectangular box for something like 15 or 20 bucks. I remember Carmelo having a bunch of these. I've always been a little leery of any of them that do not contain honey onyxes or white-base red-ribbon Rainbos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
migbar Posted June 20, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 20, 2011 Hmmm.....those are the ones that I WOULD be leery of.....whether it was 4 boxes in one, or a single box, with those marbles. The honey onyx don't look like they were made before 1929, and I know from the records that they sold boxes of prima agates from 1925-1928. I think that wonderful number five display box that Craig had awhile back may have some real prima agates in it, but they looked like carnelians, as I remember. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBlock Posted June 20, 2011 Report Share Posted June 20, 2011 I would be leery of any 4+1 set that had marbles in it. I cannot recall ever seeing any, way back when, that were filled. OTOH, I saw several single boxes filled with honey onyxes back then, and I'd bet they were original. The marbles were worth a lot more sold individually than the sets were selling for. FWIW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steph Posted June 20, 2011 Report Share Posted June 20, 2011 Some 1927 inventory sheets from Mike related to the Prima Agate question: (click to enlarge - might need to doubleclick for full size) . . . . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBlock Posted June 20, 2011 Report Share Posted June 20, 2011 Interesting. 2,638 Prima nests x 4 boxes per nest x 25 marbles per box = 263,800 marbles. And only 18,000 Prima Agates of all sizes in inventory. So, it would appear they had a large bulk order of boxes printed up and constructed, but only filled them in anticipation of orders. It could be that when the agreement was severed with Peltier in 1931, there were still a number of empty boxes in inventory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
migbar Posted June 20, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 20, 2011 I think between 1929 and late 1931 they might have put other marbles in those boxes, instead of primas, such as honey onyx and the others, but probably not after that. I can't see them using Gropper boxes after ending their partnership in 1931. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBlock Posted June 20, 2011 Report Share Posted June 20, 2011 This is the box I have in my collection: I purchased this box in 1993. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBlock Posted June 20, 2011 Report Share Posted June 20, 2011 Oops, the box top as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steph Posted June 20, 2011 Report Share Posted June 20, 2011 Would those be the Milky marbles from the inventory? Or do you think those are later than 1927? (I'd have guessed later.) And what are the other candidates for Pelt Milky mibs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
migbar Posted June 20, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 20, 2011 My guess is that the honey onyx like Bob showned are from 1930-1931. They began making the milkies in July of 1927. They looked like the honey onyx but without the orangey smudge, I believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBlock Posted June 20, 2011 Report Share Posted June 20, 2011 The Milkies are like semi-opaque moonies, but without the opalescence Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuckEye Posted June 20, 2011 Report Share Posted June 20, 2011 This is all great info. Mike, can I see the marbles Gino had described here: I think they should be a hand gathered type. Gino Biffany told me once that he thought they were predominately red swirls with a translucent grey and white marbleized body. Thanks, Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
migbar Posted June 20, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 20, 2011 Boy, I wish. I spoke with Gino this morning, and he said he read that description somewhere, but he hasn't seen one in person. I dug a few that look similar to that description, but I am unable to post pictures here with my new computer, maybe Stephanie can help me....just a sec.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steph Posted June 20, 2011 Report Share Posted June 20, 2011 All the pix are clickable. (maybe double click) . . . . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
migbar Posted June 20, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 20, 2011 Thank you Stephanie ! The first four might be only cerise onyx or cerise agates. In the last picture I think the marble in the middle of the bottom row is intertesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spara50 Posted June 21, 2011 Report Share Posted June 21, 2011 Here is a box I used to own, just as I found it at an auction in the middle of Kansas. Had not been touched as far as I know. Salesmans sample box with prima agates. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBlock Posted June 21, 2011 Report Share Posted June 21, 2011 The ones on the far right look like CAC American Agates. It's possible, since Gropper also wholesaler from CAC as well as Peltier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
migbar Posted June 21, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2011 That is the box I was referring to earlier, and they all look Peltier to me. The marbles aren't all in the right places, and there is no milkie, and the ones to the right look carnelianish, with no grey, though. Great box, whatever they are. I think the parts to Craig's box; the box, inserts, and container; are listed on the 3rd page of the inventory papers shown earlier in this thread. mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuckEye Posted June 21, 2011 Report Share Posted June 21, 2011 Craig, that is a great box with great examples. I can see those as primas. I have a few hand gathered ones like that, that don't quite look like they should be CA's. The glass on mine doesn't look ca either. But the last row does look like American agates. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
migbar Posted June 21, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2011 Yep, that ol' Arnold Fiedler had a lot of Peltier knowledge when he went to Christensen ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marboman Posted June 21, 2011 Report Share Posted June 21, 2011 I'm curious about the glassonix reference.I posted this marble in the ID section and first thoughts were a bloody or tracer type that had been damaged by CLR.After taking better pics I will submit this for a second reveiw.I am no expert but in my opinion this appears to be an experimental, maybe an alternative to aventurine since it is fabulous in direct sunlight.Glassonix?If this marble had been damaged by CLR wouldn't either the red or white ribbon be gone?At any rate I do believe iot to be an experimental.What do you think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sissydear Posted June 21, 2011 Report Share Posted June 21, 2011 Mike, in spite of their "dugness" those marbles you dug are pretty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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