richsantaclaus Posted June 8, 2011 Report Share Posted June 8, 2011 Being in the collecting of vintage marbles for just over a year now, I wonder what our group thinks about a person being referred to as an expert in the marble collecting world. Of course, not all marbles lend themselves to be named and, of course, mistakes will certainly happen - after all, we are human...lol. Many things cross my mind thinking of a definition of an expert vintage marble collector: 1) The number of years the person has been collecting vintage marbles 2) The number of years spent studying the history of the marbles or having a great deal of knowledge about, or skill, training, or experience in, a collecting vintage marbles 3) Has the person been at the site where the marbles were made (like at a dig) 4) Has the person seen a marble making machine and knows the ins-and-outs of the workings thereof 5) Is this person others go to for a final question I am wondering how you feel about this question. Do you have other things you look for that person you'd call an expert? I look forward to a positive input from the members of our group and I hope to learn from your experiences to make my own journey an intelligent one to find that special marble I just MUST have...lol Thanks Rich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richsantaclaus Posted June 9, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2011 Someone emailed me and suggested I cross off #1...lol How do you feel about that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steph Posted June 9, 2011 Report Share Posted June 9, 2011 What a delightful question. Time doesn't necessarily bring expertise but it is needed for perspective, and can you be an expert without perspective? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marboman Posted June 9, 2011 Report Share Posted June 9, 2011 Yes,that first one offends me too!I can't believe how many years I've been collecting these things.What the hell's wrong with me?.... LOL! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steph Posted June 9, 2011 Report Share Posted June 9, 2011 Bo, have you spent 10,000 hours with them? That's one rule of thumb for what it takes to be an expert. Here's an interesting read from Wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Expert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marboman Posted June 9, 2011 Report Share Posted June 9, 2011 I may have,but that's not enough to make someone an expert in itself.I collect mostly machine-mades and what knowledge I have or think I have is in that area.I would expect an expert to have knowledge of all marble types,handmade,machine-mades,contemp etc.An expert might also answer yes to #3,4,and 5 of Rich's list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richsantaclaus Posted June 9, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2011 lol... nothing is wrong with anyone...lol I hope this thread is something we all can have an input on as I sure am loving it so far! Nice link too and it is VERY interesting - thanks! Thanks for your insights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBlock Posted June 9, 2011 Report Share Posted June 9, 2011 The 10,000 hour rule is the basis for Malcolm Gladwell's book Outliers, which was a best seller about 3 years ago. It's a quick read and well worth the couple of hours if you have an interest in this type of thing. Not quite as good as Blink ot Tipping Point, IMHO, a couple of his other books. Gladwell is actually interviewed in the HBO movie, Bobby Fischer Against The World, which premiered on HBO this past Monday, and he applies the theory to Bobby Fischer (and Grand Master chess players in general). I thought it was a good documentary, and I think is still running on HBO in repeat, or On Demand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lstmmrbls Posted June 9, 2011 Report Share Posted June 9, 2011 I have met some folks that know quite a bit about certain areas of the hobby. Met some with a good general knowledge. Met a few that can ID many marbles. Haven't met an expert yet and doubt I ever will. An expert should know about all and every aspect of the hobby. How who when where what etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richsantaclaus Posted June 9, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2011 I wonder if a person can just be an expert in one specialized area of collecting like Akro marbles or Vitro marbles and doesn't have to know everything about Master marbles or others. Like a doctor specializing in brain surgery verses being a foot specialist. Both are experts in their chosen field. I sure am learning a lot - thanks again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hdesousa Posted June 9, 2011 Report Share Posted June 9, 2011 There are undoubtedly many marble experts, specialists in their particular fields; but I know of only two that have the perspective Steph is talking about. One was fooled by the California sulphides, at least until he got home and his wife pointed out that the cherub was a copy of The Grateful Dead's album cover. He has since dropped out of marbles. The other expert I rely on all the time for IDing machine mades. Both however, became reluctant to ID marbles at shows, since telling a collector that a particular marble was not as good as they thought usually turned out to be a lose-lose-lose situation. (angry collector-the dealer who sold the marble to the collector - and the expert who had to fend off wrath from both sides) In other collectables hobbies, such as stamps or coins, one can always get an item reliably authenticated. Any ideas on how to get a reliable ID for a marble? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richsantaclaus Posted June 9, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2011 Good question! Because I work with several types of old, vintage glass cullet, I usually can tell the type of glass I am working on to make/repair a marble but I am no expert, just well seasoned...lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lstmmrbls Posted June 9, 2011 Report Share Posted June 9, 2011 Afraid I have caused the blood pressure to increase in more than a few collectors at shows. Most are a bit shocked when you point out the polished and torch made marbles. I try to do it nicely but when they ask I tell. I found 3 torch made CACs in one keeper box. He only asked about 1 so that is the only one I showed how to tell it was torchmade. They get more obvious the more you buy to learn what they look like. Folks that never buy the fakes or polished marbles will have a much harder time knowing when they have one in their hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richsantaclaus Posted June 9, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2011 Good point - thanks! Experience speaks volumes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steph Posted June 9, 2011 Report Share Posted June 9, 2011 Any ideas on how to get a reliable ID for a marble? Swirl ID-ing seems to be the most inexact of the present marble sciences. When people try to ID transparent swirls by maker it sometimes makes me laugh. Heck, maybe they're right in some of their more obscure guesses, but how can anyone be sure? To me there seems to be a lack of replicability to that part of the discipline. I want whoever I consult on that type of ID to be able to say "I don't know". If they don't have the security to say that with grace, then I will view them with some doubt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psia-antique Posted June 9, 2011 Report Share Posted June 9, 2011 Swirl ID-ing seems to be the most inexact of the present marble sciences. When people try to ID transparent swirls by maker it sometimes makes me laugh. Heck, maybe they're right in some of their more obscure guesses, but how can anyone be sure? To me there seems to be a lack of replicability to that part of the discipline. I want whoever I consult on that type of ID to be able to say "I don't know". If they don't have the security to say that with grace, then I will view them with some doubt. Great post! It is about time someone said it out loud. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richsantaclaus Posted June 9, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2011 Good point - saying, "I don't know" is what I'd expect an expert to do if they didn't know = my respect for that person! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MARBLEMISER Posted June 9, 2011 Report Share Posted June 9, 2011 One problem that I have had since collecting 24 yrs. It begins with going to auctions. When I showed up at several auctions, bid & bought several marbles. The auctioneer will remember you. Then he starts to call you marble man or " there's my marble expert"/ This create's a problem for me, but not for him. If I bid on a marble or a group of marbles & someone that has little knowledge sees me bidding, then they (the mibs ) must be good or I wouldn't be bidding on them. So the bidding war starts. I never said that I was an expert, but was labeled as such. I used to get someone to bid on the marbles for me. That worked for a while. But it caught on. When the auctioneer called me marbleman I always said that I don't know anything about what you're talking about. But in such small circles it's hard to hide. I've had other collectors ask me,at auctions what I was going to bid on? I would say wait & see. Then they would bid against me even if they didn't know what the marble was. JUST SO I didn't get too cheap!!! Anyway, I quit going to auctions to buy mibs. I just look at what I have & am happy with them. A reputation as an expert isn't something I asked for I was framed!!! The more I think I know the less I remember what I forgot. marblemiser Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triker Posted June 9, 2011 Report Share Posted June 9, 2011 AMEN! Bruce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richsantaclaus Posted June 9, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2011 Thanks - wonderful story too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ann Posted June 10, 2011 Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 Swirl ID-ing seems to be the most inexact of the present marble sciences. When people try to ID transparent swirls by maker it sometimes makes me laugh. Heck, maybe they're right in some of their more obscure guesses, but how can anyone be sure? To me there seems to be a lack of replicability to that part of the discipline. I want whoever I consult on that type of ID to be able to say "I don't know". If they don't have the security to say that with grace, then I will view them with some doubt. What Steph said and what Steve said! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
popeyecollector Posted June 11, 2011 Report Share Posted June 11, 2011 Interesting thread. I have written all this before, but here it is again: Develop and refine your marble knowledge by reading books, attend meetings, talk with dealers - collectors and handle many, many marbles. You will gradually learn who has worthwhile opinions based on the ever evolving field of marble collecting. From your experiences, develop your own inner crap detection system. Remember --- a) - Seriously doubt anyone who claims to be a marble expert! - Be more apt to listen to advice from a collector offering an opinion - if - they have no vested interest in your marble. c) - Much like fishing, stay close to where the other boats are fishing. d) - Avoid anyone linked to any past history of questionable marble dealings. Big Indian but no braid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winnie Posted June 11, 2011 Report Share Posted June 11, 2011 What about ID-ing foreign marbles. It's groping in the dark,It's a pity that there is hardly anything known about foreign marbles. Usually we can guess when and where and by who the foreigns are made,so speaking of experts.... I now realize that no longer all marbles are foreign marbles to me,LOL only have to find out which marbles have been made here. winnie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richsantaclaus Posted June 11, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2011 Nice list pop! Winnie - ti me foreign means everything not in the US - is that a group or what...lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winnie Posted June 11, 2011 Report Share Posted June 11, 2011 Oh yes,it's an incredibly large group of marbles LOL. winnie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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