Melted marbles

[hdesousa]

This melted block of marbles was bought from Bert Cohen in 2011.  Story goes it was recovered from the great Chicago fire of 1871.  I have a smaller block hiding somewhere, with better marbles, and I've seen others. Surface looks dusty and cloudy - that's from the fire.

[Ric]

Those are cool too. I would not have thought a structural fire would get hot enough to melt and fuse them like that.

[Carowill]

Apparently it takes 2600-2800 degrees Fahrenheit to melt glass but it it will lose its shape around 1360-1450 degrees F.  A house fire is on average 1000 degrees F but can reach 1500, especially at the ceiling.

[I'llhavethat1]

Cool.  I'm curious about the (what appears to be) opaque red on aqua.  Greiners? 

Have you counted them?  Looks like more than 32...(I was originally thinking Solitaire group).

And then the "grill marks" on two of the sides of the mass.  Any clue what they were in then melted to leave those marks?  Cool item

[hdesousa]

4 minutes ago, I'llhavethat1 said:

Cool.  I'm curious about the (what appears to be) opaque red on aqua.  Greiners? 

Have you counted them?  Looks like more than 32...(I was originally thinking Solitaire group).

And then the "grill marks" on two of the sides of the mass.  Any clue what they were in then melted to leave those marks?  Cool item

No idea what the 'grill marks' could be from.  Several blocks of melted marbles appeared at shows and on eBay at the same time, of various sizes. In some, you could tell they had been mint marbles, and pretty nice ones, but I don't remember seeing any Greiners.

[BobBlock]

There have been a few of these for sale over the past 20 years or so. Whether from the Chicago fire or not, I can't say. But clearly melted together. And pretty much every kid had a pouch of marbles, and there were a lot more house fires 125 years ago than there are now. So, the story (if not the location) is generally accepted to be true.

 

[Ric]

27 minutes ago, BobBlock said:

There have been a few of these for sale over the past 20 years or so. Whether from the Chicago fire or not, I can't say. But clearly melted together. And pretty much every kid had a pouch of marbles, and there were a lot more house fires 125 years ago than there are now. So, the story (if not the location) is generally accepted to be true.

It makes me wonder how many mad Mothers or Fathers tossed a whole bag in the wood stove.

[Fire1981]

I wonder how hot a raging bond fire stacked with of oak pallets would get? I responded to a double wide fire that we had to just watch it burn down. We were foaming the other trailers in the trailer park. The people who owned the trailer kept their coin collection in the crawl space. We were mopping up and dug up the coin collection. I would say 75% melted but the unmelted coins were face down in the dirt. 🔥

[Fire1981]

I love this stuff 🔥

RAR

[PittsburghMarbles]

That would be really freaking awesome if true that these were from the great Chicago fire. 

[Shamrock Marbles]

On 3/10/2023 at 6:02 PM, hdesousa said:

This melted block of marbles was bought from Bert Cohen in 2011.  Story goes it was recovered from the great Chicago fire of 1871.  I have a smaller block hiding somewhere, with better marbles, and I've seen others. Surface looks dusty and cloudy - that's from the fire.

Hmmm…

Considering that this went through a fire, then the lack of carbon or char embedded on the melted surfaces is most intriguing.

Had the marbles been in a cardboard box, wood box, cloth bag or leather pouch (all organic materials), then their burning would have left carbon residue on all the surfaces. Even the interior surfaces.

The corrugated surface reminds me of ceramic kiln paper.

Remember to buy the item, not the “story”.  -John

[Ric]

Here is an interesting excerpt from an article titled Relics of the Fire, that was published in The Little Corporal: An Original Magazine for Boys and Girls and for Older People Who Have Young Hearts, Emily Huntington Miller, Editor, Chicago, March, 1872, pp. 109-10.

"The toy shops—alas! how can I tell the
tragedies there! Dolls with glass eyes melt-
ed out; wax dolls with complexion melted
off; long haired beauties, with not a hair to
their heads; all black and horrid. Square
blocks of beautiful glass marbles welded
together, and bent as though made of wax;
chunks of china dolls, of all sizes, joined
for life in grotesque ways. But, saddest of
all, china babies in bath tubs, who it seems
are packed in pairs (one turned upside down
on another, as you put a cover on a dish),
. fastened together in such a way, that one
of the unfortunate babies must always sit
on its head!"

[Da Roberto]

Take a look here...

https://www.greatchicagofire.org/item/ichi-64557/

https://www.allaboutmarbles.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=48372&p=350491&hilit=Mystery+of+art#p350491

[Shamrock Marbles]

There are more than a few museums that have questionable items in their collections.

Study the provenance, not the superficial “story”.

After the great Chicago fire, there were “entrepreneurs” that exploited the fire to gain financially.

Glass marbles are not immune to “historical distortions” or “names” to enhance market pricing.

Internet postings are not proof of authenticity.  Caveat emptor!! 

[Da Roberto]

On 3/7/2023 at 23:36, Shamrock Marbles said:

Ci sono più di pochi musei che hanno oggetti discutibili nelle loro collezioni.

Studia la provenienza, non la “storia” superficiale.

Dopo il grande incendio di Chicago, ci sono stati degli “imprenditori” che hanno sfruttato l'incendio per guadagnare economicamente.

Le biglie di vetro non sono immuni da "distorsioni storiche" o "nomi" per migliorare i prezzi di mercato.

I post su Internet non sono una prova di autenticità. Avvertimento!! 

Certainly,... to be taken into account

[rockgardenplants]

On 3/16/2023 at 2:52 PM, Ric said:

Here is an interesting excerpt from an article titled Relics of the Fire, that was published in The Little Corporal: An Original Magazine for Boys and Girls and for Older People Who Have Young Hearts, Emily Huntington Miller, Editor, Chicago, March, 1872, pp. 109-10.

"The toy shops—alas! how can I tell the
tragedies there! Dolls with glass eyes melt-
ed out; wax dolls with complexion melted
off; long haired beauties, with not a hair to
their heads; all black and horrid. Square
blocks of beautiful glass marbles welded
together, and bent as though made of wax;
chunks of china dolls, of all sizes, joined
for life in grotesque ways. But, saddest of
all, china babies in bath tubs, who it seems
are packed in pairs (one turned upside down
on another, as you put a cover on a dish),
. fastened together in such a way, that one
of the unfortunate babies must always sit
on its head!"

Nice bit of internet research! Great info and yes, this kind of story can be a great boost to my day.

[Fire1981]

Silver will melt at 1800 degrees. Glass melts at 2600-2800 degrees. Steel melt at 2500 degrees and Forest fires range between 1600 -1800 degrees. 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥

RAR

[Nantucketdink]

I have melted bottles in campfires many times.  It takes several hours, but I am talking about relatively small campfires burning for probably less than 12 hours.  Just saying.  I can’t explain the chemistry, but have seen it happen repeatedly.  Very deformed bottles from campfire heat alone.

[cheese]

Me too, bottles in campfires, melted window panes from house fires, etc... I've metal detected several old home sites where the home burned and found deformed marbles. Many of thos old homes were made of heart pine (longleaf pine) which was full of pine tar pitch and burned very hot. 

I have the remains of a Pressman Big Shot box of Alleys that was in a fire and all that is left is the melted glob of marbles. 

Very cool piece hdesousa. The ridges underneath look like quarter sawn wood grain. Here's mine, not nearly as old but same concept.

 

[Da Roberto]

Nice piece!
I am always attracted to these things