Steph Posted April 7, 2008 Report Share Posted April 7, 2008 When did Akro cork production start? How far can the date be narrowed down? For example, I know it was somewhat before May 1, 1930. Had to be because that's when the Prize Name naming contest ended. But how much before that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akro gatherer Posted April 7, 2008 Report Share Posted April 7, 2008 I cant tell you a date but I can tell you how many feet down they are. LOL :Cartoon_177: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akronmarbles Posted April 8, 2008 Report Share Posted April 8, 2008 Fall of 1928 was the start of production according my research. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hdesousa Posted April 8, 2008 Report Share Posted April 8, 2008 Fall of 1928 was the start of production according my research. And the source for this research is........? (Akro's 1 July 1929 Confidential Jobber's price list does not mention spirals nor prizenames.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Oregon Posted April 8, 2008 Report Share Posted April 8, 2008 American Machine Marbles book states that John Early developed the 'adapter' (spiiner cup) between 1928 and 1930 - that would be for the corks so the time frame fits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I LOVE MARBLES Posted April 8, 2008 Report Share Posted April 8, 2008 Hi Hansel, welcome, seeing newbie under your name makes me laugh! Does anyone have any real info on just when Akro started making corkscrews? My guess is that they did make corkscrews a long time before 1928. The number of Akro's I've bought from the diggers, so few are hand gathered, don't buy the 1928 date on corks. I do not believe the eye lash = dull cutters either. Scott Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hdesousa Posted April 8, 2008 Report Share Posted April 8, 2008 American Machine Marbles book states that John Early developed the 'adapter' (spiiner cup) between 1928 and 1930 - that would be for the corks so the tiem frame fits. Best not to rely on unreferenced sources. Should not keep perpetuating marble collector/author myths indefinitely. We know (from that jobbers' list) that Akro was probably not selling corks 1 July 1929, and by 1 May 1930 the prizename competition was over. Can anyone reliably narrow down when Akro first marketed the corkscrew? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lstmmrbls Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 I have not seen any literature dated 1929 that has corksrews mentioned for sale. I believe late 29 is about when the machines were perfected enough for full time production. Patent dates do not really mean muchas the machinery was often being used before the patent was granted. But Seeing as Gob feeders were not used until the late 20s I feel the 29 date is probably a good one for Corkscrews. There was also a fair amount of developement of the corkscrew making equipment. It was finally perfected with the introduction of a rod in association with the spinning cup. It is what made the ghost like spiral one can often see in the center of some transparent based corkscrews. Peace,Galen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FIRE81 Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 Thanx Galen ! I always wondered what caused that "Bubbley Ghost Spiral" ! Mechanical Question: Did this ROD...push the Clear Baseglass into the Cup ? If so...when the ROD would retract....the BUBBLES are the signature of the "VORTEX" caused by this "ACTION"...??? The CUP would CLOSE....(bubbles in the baseglass)....Cup would SPIN....the bubbles where simply TRAPPED in the MATRIX of the marble.....and just "WENT FOR THE RIDE" in there ? Or....the ROD pushed the SINGLE COLOR....(same reaction) I'm just not gonna type MY entire THEORY/QUESTION over again. Scott........you don't think the LASHES were cause by a hasty sharpening of the cutters that left BURRS on the cutters ???? The burrs wear off after a certain amount of time elapsed...and the LASHES diminish ??? That was kinda of "IN YOUR FACE".....Scott...!!! SORRY......!!! Do you have another explanation or some insight that would explain why the LASHES are only found on Akros ????? I'm goin' there.....what other Machine-Made Marbles have "The Lashes" ? Last Question: Anyone got any LAVENDAR CORKS ON CLEAR BASEGLASS ? RAR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lstmmrbls Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 It gave the now combined stream something to attach to so the stream would corkscrew(basically around the rod) creating the form we all so love.. If you just dropped a glob into the spinning cup nothing much would happen. Probably wasnt to hard for them to figure out considering they had dozens of gatherers with punties(giant version of the rod?) creating semicorkscrews at the time. Peace,Galen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 I own two Akro spinner cups dug from the site. They have grooves carved into the cup to "catch" glass and start it spinning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I LOVE MARBLES Posted April 11, 2008 Report Share Posted April 11, 2008 Quote from Rick: Scott........you don't think the LASHES were cause by a hasty sharpening of the cutters that left BURRS on the cutters ???? The burrs wear off after a certain amount of time elapsed...and the LASHES diminish ??? That was kinda of "IN YOUR FACE".....Scott...!!! SORRY......!!! Do you have another explanation or some insight that would explain why the LASHES are only found on Akros ????? I'm goin' there.....what other Machine-Made Marbles have "The Lashes" ? Rick hey man never apologize for being "IN YOUR FACE" with me cause I can handle it, in fact I LIKE IT THAT WAY!!! Exactly what you said .....if it was dull shears then why do you not see those lashes on other companies marbles???? Also Mr. Hill stole the plans for the corkscrew machine in 1907 When Akro started in Akron and packaged MFC's marbles & sold as Akro's. They did not make marbles until moving to Clarksburg in 1915. I know they were not rocket scientists at Akro, but find it hard to believe it took 14 years in Clarksburg before making any corkscrews? My guess is that they were making corkscrews within 7 years of being in Clarksburg, Though it may have taken until 1929 to perfect the machine to max production. The company called them spirals in the salesman sample box, when did that Salesman Sample box come out, what year? Scott Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lstmmrbls Posted April 11, 2008 Report Share Posted April 11, 2008 Alan, You are correct, The grooves helped grip the end of the stream and the rod gave resistance that created the corkscrew. It had to have something to basically spin around. Just dropping globs into the cup would not create a corkscrew pattern. Peace,Galen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigtee0 Posted April 13, 2008 Report Share Posted April 13, 2008 who cares? they're pretty so collect them. imho Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scoop Posted April 13, 2008 Report Share Posted April 13, 2008 Marie, I've been reading this thread and learning a little from it... Which is cool!! But, each time I read that title, I find myself saying the same as you!!! "Who Cares???" I'm also learning that a lot of people do care... So, we roll with it!! And, we learn stuff!! Thanks for having the guts to post what I've been thinkin'!!!! ROFL Disclaimer: This is in no way an attempt to belittle anyone who studies Akro Agate history!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lstmmrbls Posted April 13, 2008 Report Share Posted April 13, 2008 I guess if no one cared the most recent(and most popular) books wouldn't be purchased by anyone. The facts are Most collecters of machinemade marbles are veryinterested in who when where and how. Sue, you are coming off very belittleing and negative. Not just in this thread. The fact that you posted the disclaimer shows that you know it also. Nothing in your post was at all laughable. Something going on in your life we don't know about. Because you are dragging the board down lately IMHO. Posts like your last make it very tough not to be Serious. Maybe you should open up a handmade only board. maybe you could care over there. Peace,Galen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigtee0 Posted April 14, 2008 Report Share Posted April 14, 2008 Galen, sweetcheeks, we all care enough to collect those beautiful orbs and buy the books etc, etc, but why beat a dead horse. i was always told if you have to talk more than once you're talking to much and Lord kknows i've sure been accused of that. and these boards etc have taught me a bunch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scoop Posted April 14, 2008 Report Share Posted April 14, 2008 Galen, it's not often that I can agree with Marie... We've had our difficulties and we both try hard to meet in the middle. I try to jump at the chance to make her feel at home. I'm sure everyone else can handle it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knuckledown Posted April 14, 2008 Report Share Posted April 14, 2008 Thanks for this info. I've see the patent drawing of the cup and rod set in its mechanism. Now I have a clear picture in my mind of the process. I like knowing the who, what, when, and why. Maybe some day I won't care, but by then I'll know what it is I don't care about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steph Posted April 16, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2008 Marie, I care. I knew at least one other person also cared. He and I were talking about it by email when we came to an informational impasse and decided it might help to ask if anyone "out there" had more info. Sue, sorry. Scott, according to Cohill's book, Horace Hill started working for MFC in 1908 and it is believed his nafarious deeds took place later. Also, I think the plans he stole were still for machines to make slags. The patent application he filed in 1912 was turned down for being too close to Martin Christensen's earlier designs. Hill's 1914 application was granted but it appears that his modified designs were seriously flawed, showing how little he understood the designs he had stolen. And it does appear that it took Akro a long time to finally work out the kinks. (p.s. you messed with my head when you said lashes are only found on Akros because isn't it the lashes on master sunbursts which sometimes lead to their misidentification as sparklers?) Everyone, thanks for the input. So it does sound as if it was around the end of 1929 before Akro was ready to go live with a corkscrew promotion. Last observation which occurs to me here is that there is some ambiguity in the July 1929 pricesheet: cardinal red, onxy and imperial all being names under which corks were sold at some point. It still leaves open the possibility that corks might have been in public hands before they came into their own as a special style with new color choices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scoop Posted April 16, 2008 Report Share Posted April 16, 2008 No problem, Steph!! I really wasn't expressing an opinion as much as simply giving a nod to Marie.... Again, I apologize to those who are into "in depth history." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lstmmrbls Posted April 16, 2008 Report Share Posted April 16, 2008 The rod and cup.. And Steph those are all names used for marbles before similar glassed marbles were produced as corkscrews. They just kept the names. Peace,Galen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steph Posted April 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2008 Right. The names were used for swirled marbles. And then for corks. Thus the ambiguity. Without more info one way or the other, do we know exactly what "onyx" meant on July 1, 1929? The introduction of Prize Names involved two issues: (1) The new cork pattern. And (2) the new glass combos. The rod and cup mechanism patent was applied for in 1928 so what was stopping Akro from using it to fill up their onxy boxes in, say, March 1929? And then perhaps they started playing around with the new glass combos after they felt comfortable with their new machinery? Seems like there's still some gray area. Still some open questions at the moment. At least based on the info I've seen so far. We have some great info. I feel really good about the rough date of 1929 for the transition to corks, and it's awesome that we can be as specific as that. I'm satisfied. I simply noted the ambiguity of the names because it's stopping me from narrowing it down more than that based on what I know so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lstmmrbls Posted April 18, 2008 Report Share Posted April 18, 2008 The cardinel red corks and slags can be found in the same boxes. I would guess 1930-31 for the corkscrews. Peace,Galen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steph Posted April 18, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 18, 2008 Why that late? They were making the prize names on one machine in late 1929 or early 1930, and still making slags on other machines at the same time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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