Steph Posted January 18, 2009 Report Share Posted January 18, 2009 Now as to anyone who thinks the article was about Steve promoting his sales, that's not true. He didn't write the article or know about it before it was posted and he hasn't been listing on ebay in awhile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LouisCamp Posted January 18, 2009 Report Share Posted January 18, 2009 It's funny, when anyone makes a comment about Jabo marbles, the same people have to chime in against them or what was said. Everyone has an opinion and is entitled to their opinion. It sounds like a commercial? Are people afraid that nice modern marbles may affect the values of vintage marbles that they happen to collect? Just once I'd like to see different birds do the chirping, and not the usual birds waiting on the wire to pounce. Lou Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steph Posted January 18, 2009 Report Share Posted January 18, 2009 P.s., there are a lot of things about Jabo which are still unknown to most. Isn't that incredible?! Makes me appreciate that we know anything about the old marble companies. Having Jabo still going at all, in any form seems to me to be rescuing history and the wonder of the marble-making ... sort of like how scientists can now rescue some extinct species. Using genetic material from an old specimen and using a new host to give it a rebirth. No, not the same ... but it reminds me of it. Jabo and Dave McCullough are the keepers of what is left of the old companies' DNA, and they've made some new history with it. Pretty exciting to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winnie Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 I know I'm an outsider of this subject but be honest Jabo does not have the patterns of CAC,Peltier or Akro. Jabo makes nice swirls but they don't make Corks,NLR's flames or whatever. So you never can compare it with the old company's in my opinion. you should be proud of the history of American machine made marbles,it's such a rich history! The future will make it clear if Jabo belongs among them. winnie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lstmmrbls Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 I never said a bad word about Dave. Never have, never will. I do not believe saying I do not consider him an artist saying something bad. If Dave thinks it is I apologize. I did not delete anything. I also never said multiple crucibles were never tried before. I implied in these runs it was someone elses idea, and I will stick with that. And sure there have been some early attempts to add mica and maybe even aventurine(although most was accidental)(but they sure as heck didn't ammount to anything.) I also didn't hijack this thread at all. And when is the last time Hansel or Mike bothered chirping over here. I am glad I can take the personal attacks for feeling differently than the folks that are so high on the new Jabos. I am sure there are many more(actually I know there are) that simply don't post because of the personal attacks that are so freely given to some one that expresses a different opinion. As a matter of fact it just might be a silent majority(at least among vintage collecters and those that don't sell Jabos) Peace,Galen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sissydear Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 Mike is correct about Boyce being in charge of their run. Our first run was right after Boyce and Mike's. Boyce hung around and watched ours. I remember Boyce saying that he was going to let Dave do his next run because Dave got prettier marbles. Now I disagree with that somewhat. Boyce got some gorgeous marbles, unlike any of the other JABO experimentals for the most part. I loved the pink ones Boyce got using gold in the glass. Mike never said a negative thing in his posts. He simply gave his favorite marble maker without downing anyone else. There is a proper way to disagree and then there is the other way - criticizing the marbles and Dave. Edna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sissydear Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 Galen, you said this: And whose ideas was it to use the goldstones and other materials. If you say it was all Daves ideas I know a few people that might take offense to that. And don't dare try tell me it was his idea to use multiple crucibles which helped in the last runs. Do you really believe adding a bunch of different bought glass into the pot to create multiple colors is that big of a deal. Implying that the stuff being done at the recent Jabo runs is anywhere near the genius of Peltier, Christensen, Fiedler or even Alley is rediculous peace,Galen It's the same old thing brought up each time. How many times do you have to hear the truth? And this one: I am sure Dave appreciates some folks elevating him to the status of these early guiniuses. Peace,Galen This sounds like the same old thing too. You just can't stand for Dave to have admirers. You "down" him at every opportunity. And then there is this one: LOLSHIPMP laughing out loud so hard I peed my pants Laughing about Dave being given some praise? You get real, Galen. Please stop posting on and reading the JABO posts that you can't stand. You are not simply having a different opinion. You are downing Dave and the marbles. I don't care if you don't like the marbles or think highly of Dave. Some of us do and we've heard enough of your version. It's our post. Go back to your board and post what you like. Again, I say I WILL NEVER BE CRITICAL OF YOUR MARBLES, YOUR FAVORITE ARTIST, OR TRY TO RUIN YOUR POSTS WITH NEGATIVITY. Edna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest FeelingMarbleous Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 isn't marble collecting so fun :Sad_headshake_tweetz: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duffy Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 another weak attempt....you could have said nothing than to say dave wasnt an artist...how should that matter to you...all i am sayin if you dont like it dont bother with it...simple...you did hijack the thread...not a personal attack...but youre gettin close to attackin me by sayin i cant comprehend what you say....you said lotsa people were better at what dave does....not an attack....you should invite all your very cl,ose friends here so they can put forth their ideas...not a personal att ack...did they appoint you their representive....not an attack....let them speak for themselves...not an attack..you insulting and judgemental..not an attack...just disagreements....ill say again.....just by-pass the thread about the jabos...it wont hurt you....not an attack...you always twist words after you say one thing then its something else why galen...is it important to you to belittle people....some people like these marbles...you belittle em by sayin theyre not worthy...it would be better if you said nothing.....but your opinion is too important to all the other vintage collectors on the planet...not an attack... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LouisCamp Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 Damn Duffy, you are really stretching the attack thing. Lou Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lstmmrbls Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 No problem Lou, It has always been OK here when the personal attacks are against me. And I will formally say here once again. Dave does and has done some great work with machine made marbles. If anything I said was taken as putting him down or being disrespectful of him I apologize. Peace,Galen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FISHSLAYERMARRBLEGRIFF Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 This makes for some good half time entertainment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duffy Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 nope lou...no problem...i dont want my words to be misunderstood... i was disagreein..... not attacking....looks like it ok as long as your sayin that youre disagreein ....i don't want any misunderstandings either...once we disagreed and like of a sudden my disagreements got turned into attacks...... capish?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steph Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 I know I'm an outsider of this subject but be honest Jabo does not have the patterns of CAC,Peltier or Akro.Jabo makes nice swirls but they don't make Corks,NLR's flames or whatever. So you never can compare it with the old company's in my opinion. you should be proud of the history of American machine made marbles,it's such a rich history! The future will make it clear if Jabo belongs among them. winnie Funny you should say that about flames Winnie. !! I've been planning to start a thread at Jaboland asking people to post their best Jabo flames, maybe including a sort of contest to see who could find a flame with the most points. I have many which are reminiscent of Alleys, and some which to me look like nice, busy Champ furnace swirls. Some are mushy and some have buttcracks, but some are SHARP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest FeelingMarbleous Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 and some which to me look like nice, busy Champ furnace swirls. Don't get carried away there Steph but they do look very much like some super busy WV mibs and being those are my favorite types well you already know lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steph Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 and some which to me look like nice, busy Champ furnace swirls. Don't get carried away there Steph but they do look very much like some super busy WV mibs and being those are my favorite types well you already know lol Some of them do! I said so to Randy a coupla weeks ago when he posted this Champ ... and one day I'm going to get the pix to back up my claim. The Jabo Charleston might be where I've noticed it the most. This Charleston which Bob posted is more on the flamey side, but some of mine have lots of little hooks very much like Randy's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delkins Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 Yeah, I definitely prefer his earlier work. He made some Bomb Champions! Somebody should write a book about Champions. -Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian5635 Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 The real importance of the Poor Richard's Almanac article was lost on the negative people. It's importance is that it is the first article of which I am aware that is outside the marble community that recognises the greatness of JABO and David's body of work. It is also the first to name him as the best machine-made marble maker ever. Wow! IMHO, the quote (last sentence) above is where this thread took a left turn. A comment was made (or taken from the article) that Dave was mentioned as the best machine-made marble maker ever. That may be true in some peoples eyes, however it's ok for others to disagree respectfully. It's no different than someone saying that Joe Montana was the best QB ever and others saying it was Johnny Unitas or Joe Namath. Why can't marblers just have a healthy debate. It's ok to agree to disagree. For the record (and I have no skin in the game), I agree with Galen and the others. By the way, I like the new JABOS and think they are cool. However, they don't compare to the old Pelts, CAC's, MFC's and some Akros IMHO. Just saying... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marboman Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 Wow this has become a real barn burner.I have tried to look at both sides of the subject by speaking about what I like compared to what I don't like about Jabo.The last time I looked this was an open forum,meaning people should be able to give there honest opinion,without the fear of reprisal from members that dissagree.Maybe things would be different (more particapation) if this was the practice.Sadly it is not. Even though I know this will anger some I will tell another truth.I have noticed over and over again on the ID board,when members find out ther marble (being IDed) is a Jabo they are dissapointed.They say "I was hoping it was a pelt"or a CAC or MFC but they never say they wish it had been a Jabo.Why is that the case? Bo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steph Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 Even though I know this will anger some I will tell another truth.I have noticed over and over again on the ID board,when members find out ther marble (being IDed) is a Jabo they are dissapointed.They say "I was hoping it was a pelt"or a CAC or MFC but they never say they wish it had been a Jabo.Why is that the case? Bo Don't see why that should anger. There are a few reasons I can think of for the disappointment. Most having nothing to do with the quality or attractions of Jabos. (imho) Often members are hoping to have a marble which people will esteem, for the age, the name or the monetary value. In other words, many simply place more value on non-Jabos, period. It's the same marble before and after the id is made. But the name carries more weight to them than the marble itself. Newbies often love Jabos for their looks. They often have to learn disdain. Similar thing happens with Alleys and CAC's. A "CAC" can lose it's value when it is discovered to be merely a gorgeous Alley. It's the name, not the quality of the marble. An example of a non-superficial reason (imho) is the goal of learning how to i.d. marbles. As long as members can't tell the difference between Jabos and others it means that they haven't reached their goal. that's naturally frustrating. I do like old things myself, and like to know they have history. But that's still something apart from the quality of the marble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marboman Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 ..you insulting and judgemental..not an attack...just disagreements....ill say again.....just by-pass the thread about the jabos...it wont hurt you....not an attack...you always twist words after you say one thing then its something else why galen...is it important to you to belittle people....some people like these marbles...you belittle em by sayin theyre not worthy...it would be better if you said nothing.....but your opinion is too important to all the other vintage collectors on the planet...not an attack... Hello Steph, I respect your opinion but I think those good people would have rather had a Peltier or a CAC....etc.Did you read the part fear of retaliation from those who dissagree?Here is a recent example,specifically the part "it would be better if you said nothing". Does this promote an open forum? Bo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marboman Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 Bo, You obviously don't really want the facts. If you doubt me, then do your own research. Steve,in my opinion you are to bias to have an objective conversation about Jabo marbles. Bo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steph Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 Hello Steph, I respect your opinion but I think those good people would have rather had a Peltier or a CAC....etc. Right. they would have rather had a Peltier or a CAC ... etc. But it's still the same marble. They would have been happy with it if it were a CAC. They're unhappy with it because it is a Jabo. That seems to be more about the name than the intrinsic attributes of the marble itself. Did you read the part fear of retaliation from those who dissagree?Here is a recent example,specifically the part "it would be better if you said nothing". Does this promote an open forum? Bo Sometimes it would be better if someone said nothing. Some people think I should have said nothing. I didn't see retaliation for disagreement though. Mike uses gentle language and people respond gently, even when they disagree. Galen uses blunt and sometimes confrontational language and the responses are not so gentle. More or less the same message was delivered though by both men. It wasn't the disagreement which caused any "retaliation". It was the manner, with complications due to past history. You took a firm yet relatively lowkey route to begin with, and got a milder response. Then your posts seemed more challenging, and things are escalating now. Freedom of speech doesn't mean freedom from consequences. Freedom of speech doesn't exonerate one of causing pain. If someone feels strongly enough about what they're going to say to risk causing pain, okay, but there it is. Consquences. The one thing I felt in-the-zone certain about when I wrote it was that Galen hadn't hijacked the thread. At least he didn't make the initial detour from the intended topic. It was a bit hard to follow after that. I hurt my friends' feelings by saying that. And they might not forgive me. I felt strongly about it though and I made my choice because I hate it when people think something is unfair but won't say anything because they don't want to rock the boat. All of my friends know the pain of that. There's a famous saying: "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing." Galen doesn't need anything from me, but I needed to defend him on that one point. on principle. You guys have at it. I've taken my stand and my hit. I would rather everyone be honest and factual, but it's so wild in here that I don't think I'll be able to tell anymore what the facts are. *diving into the nearest foxhole* *taking my Charlestons with me* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duffy Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 ....if the stars of the article...[sturtz] would have been another person...galen would have said nothing......this just didnt start with this article here....noone can say anything good about the experimentals without galen dissing them...is that discussion in an open forum...no...... thats throwin salt in the wound....the jokers were promoted and hyped to death and mr wilcox was paid to show disagreement...to keep the discussion going...to get people thinking...in other words..to dupe people...not nescessarily the way id do it...kinda a back door approach... bo...the reason folks get disapointed when they post sumptin for id and find out its a jobo is prob because they paid big money for it and now their investment is kaput......whatever.....its a personal thing and galen cant wait to jump on sturtz.......nothing to do about marbles...i dont know if it jealously or someting else but sturtz is the main reason for the disdain....if the star of the article woulda been someone else the article wouldve been accepted in a different way....bo it would be better if nothing was said if the thing said was said to cause hate and discontent......oh i forgot the blanket disclaimer .....imho....peace steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marble_intimadator Posted January 19, 2009 Report Share Posted January 19, 2009 Short and sweet! A NEW BIRD talking. I myself am getting tired of the constant jabber about Jabo by the INVESTORS. The word investors says it all. Out to make the almighty buck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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